2 M balfouri in one enclosure

[Whitelightning777]

Does M balfouri do well when a pair of them are raised together as opposed to 3 or 4 or more?

How much bigger does the cage have to be?

Just slightly larger then for 1 or twice as large.

I probably can't do that now, just curious.

 

[crystalfreakkk]

I personally haven't had the chance to have M. Balfouri but I find them interesting so I researched them a bit. I'm definitely not an expert but I suspect that they would be fine together just the two of them, as long as you feed them appropriately and give them plenty of room. I would say twice the size to be safe, you don't want them feeling crowded. I would like to have a M. Balfouri community but don't have the space for them at the moment. There are a lot of cool videos on youtube of peoples M. Balfouri communities. They're really cool tarantulas since they can live communally, apparently they also make great moms, raising their young past when a normal tarantula would.

 

[viper69]

No one has observed this species being communal in the wild, there are no reports of it.

Captivity induces all sorts of abnormal behavior. Going communal has its risks, less so w/this species.

They do well when they have enough space and are well fed, or you end up with one T.

 

[Whitelightning777]

So, if I try again with that species it's best to get just one?

 

[Scarabyte]

So, if I try again with that species it's best to get just one?

No one's saying you can't, Tom Moran has a communual that's going great, it's just not a guarantee it'll work out.
Some people have great luck with it, others don't

 

[Whitelightning777]

Oh, ok. Most of the communal colonies have 4 to 6 spiders in them, not just 2. It probably just boils down to food supply.

To clarify, there are cases of cannibalism with M balfouri that weren't malnourished, correct?

 

[Noodile]

IveIgot a pair of M Balfouri. I wanted to try a communal, but was only able to find 2 thethe same size. They are unrelated, so this was a complete experiment. Both are doing well and show no signs of aggression.

A few points to note: I have only had them for about 2 months. They are approx. 1" slings. I haven't witnessed any interactions between them, other than when they were first 'paired'. I haven't seen more than 1 at a time, but seen both separately.

 

[Paul1126]

Considering how expensive these Ts are I would not try this

 

[ediblepain]

I have 5 slings living together since 10/17. They are all plump and happy. No issues with molting. They built a webcastle. If I give small prey items they each take one. If I give one large prey item they pile onto it and all feed at once.

 

[Haksilence]

i currently have 2 balfouri communals going strong.
one is an adult female and 5 offspring around 2-2.5" ea in a 14x6x8 enclosure (due for an upgrade).
and the second is an adult female and 12 offspring around 1-1.5" in a 24X12X14 enclosure (borderline too much room).

They dont seem to need extra space as slings and juveniles, from my observations they tend to spend the majority of their early sling days (from fresh slings to about 1"+ in the same burrow and in close proximity to the mother, and require no special feeding because the mother WILL kill prey and bring it back into the burrow for the slings. As larger slings they tend to leave their mothers burrow in favor of their own, group burrow, often with all or the vast majority sharing the same burrow and apparently cooperating in its construction. Into their early juvenile years they still tend to stay together in the same burrow as well as share larger meals.

these are only my current communals as ive had 2 before (ones where each of the mothers came from) ranging anywhere from 4 specimens to 18 specimens at one time. While i imagine 2 specimens would cohabitate fine, i cant say for certain since all of mine have been 4+. so to be on the safe side i would go for more than 2.

they key is basically overfeeding. as with any species some individuals will be more aggressive feeders than others, in order to ensure that all members of the communal are getting their meals i generally double whatever i would normally give them alone, this way there is zero chance of cannibalism due to hunger (which i have never experienced no heard of from those that have also kept this species communally) or for individuals to go without eating simply because the others got to the meal first.


bottom line is youll almost certainly be fine keeping any number of this species together with a sensible amount of space for them, but as others have pointed out, there is no guarentee. although ive never had an incident of cannibalism nor heard of anyone who has, that does not mean it is impossible and there are of course the risks, albeit very low.

 

[Haksilence]

No one has observed this species being communal in the wild, there are no reports of it.

Captivity induces all sorts of abnormal behavior. Going communal has its risks, less so w/this species.

They do well when they have enough space and are well fed, or you end up with one T.

while true, very very few people have observed this species in nature AT ALL due to the nature of their locality. honestly not much is known at all about how they habitate in the wild. From witnessing the "Motherly" nature of adult females with their fresh slings and how long the slings will remain in their mothers burrow, despite having ample room i personally am inclined to belive that groupings would not be unheard of in the wild. they seem to instinctually flock to one another prior to maturity.

As i said in my first post, my second communal has a grotesque amount of extra room, and this is their second housing since the slings were born. This was done as an experiment to see how they would act when given a significantly larger area to claim, and seeing that the slings/juveniles immediately flocked to the adult females burrow (after a few days since they were very scattered after being first housed in the enclosure) leads me to believe that they instincutally group together, at least prior to adulthood.

 

[Whitelightning777]

That's interesting. Cage size shouldn't be that different for just 2 of them. Still, 3 world be nicer and virtually guarantee that I get one of each sex.

 

[viper69]

while true, very very few people have observed this species in nature AT ALL due to the nature of their locality. honestly not much is known at all about how they habitate in the wild. From witnessing the "Motherly" nature of adult females with their fresh slings and how long the slings will remain in their mothers burrow, despite having ample room i personally am inclined to belive that groupings would not be unheard of in the wild. they seem to instinctually flock to one another prior to maturity.

As i said in my first post, my second communal has a grotesque amount of extra room, and this is their second housing since the slings were born. This was done as an experiment to see how they would act when given a significantly larger area to claim, and seeing that the slings/juveniles immediately flocked to the adult females burrow (after a few days since they were very scattered after being first housed in the enclosure) leads me to believe that they instincutally group together, at least prior to adulthood.

It may be that this is a trait observed in the wild by someone at the RIGHT time etc. However, thus far it has not been reported. Your observations are very interesting for sure.

However we know captivity can induce artificial behaviors in animals, humans included.

 

[Whitelightning777]

Regardless of whether this is an adaption to captivity or occurs naturally, it's a pretty neat trick to behold!!

Tom Moran's communal enclosure takes my breath away. I don't have the resources to replicate it or handle all those slings.

 

[sdsnybny]

That's interesting. Cage size shouldn't be that different for just 2 of them. Still, 3 world be nicer and virtually guarantee that I get one of each sex.

Not a guarantee at all, I went through 7 N. incei gold till I got a female, 1st a group of 4 all males from the same sac then a group of 3 15 months later. Odds are better with 3-5 but never a sure thing. They were all bought at less than 1/2" and just after hitting 2i.

 

[Whitelightning777]

Isn't it funny how unsexed slings always happen to be male!! 7 times in a row with 50\50 odds no less!!

Then, you find out that you don't always need molts to sex them and so on...

 

[Haksilence]

Isn't it funny how unsexed slings always happen to be male!! 7 times in a row with 50\50 odds no less!!

Then, you find out that you don't always need molts to sex them and so on...

well its not exactly 50/50 odds.
it seems that for some species, one gender is prevalent over another. C sp. "electric blues" for example supposedly have a high rate of males to females

 

[octaJon]

It may be that this is a trait observed in the wild by someone at the RIGHT time etc. However, thus far it has not been reported. Your observations are very interesting for sure.

However we know captivity can induce artificial behaviors in animals, humans included.

How true. My human captives exhibit all kinds of strange and erratic behaviors