Worried for my A Avicularia

[warhorse333]

My A Avic hasn't eaten in a month and this position it's in is worrying. I know the first thing at least a couple of you guys think is, "Oh boy, here's another amateur keeper who's been overmisting and is gonna unknowingly kill it's and it'll be written off as another case of SADS". And while I am an amateur keeper (probably even lower actually), I did enough research to know that moisture and stuffy enclosures kills Avics. As you can see in the six months I've had it it hasn't webbed in the slightest. Or molted. And while I've considered premolt as the cause of it's fast I also tried to introduce dubia roaches about 2 weeks ago and have fed nothing else. It has eaten none of them and 2 are hiding in it's enclosure. I should've reverted back to crickets, I'm stupid, I know. Anyway someone please help. I love watching this thing and I'm really worried. And here's a picture of it's whole enclosure, maybe it's too small, idk.

 

[tewebag]

I am not seeing any cross ventilation holes, do you have those?

Check it's pedipalps, do they have pink on the end of them still?

 

[Thekla]

Okay, I assume there's a water dish somewhere in the enclosure and it also has enough ventilation. Otherwise, it doesn't look too bad.

But if this is your presumed mature male, it probably won't eat that much in his remaining days. So, it's actually quite normal. Just make sure it has access to water.

 

[tewebag]

there's a water dish somewhere

Looks like a black cap to the left of cork bark, just looks empty.

 

[viper69]

There's NO SUCH THING AS SADS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[warhorse333]

There's NO SUCH THING AS SADS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I thought SADS implies that the tarantula has been over misted and choked to death in water vapor.

 

[tewebag]

I thought SADS implies that the tarantula has been over misted and choked to death in water vapor.

There is no Sudden Avic Death Syndrome, avics and their family are super easy to keep. People are just dumb and keep them horribly wrong and murder the poor thing.

 

[Ultum4Spiderz]

I thought SADS implies that the tarantula has been over misted and choked to death in water vapor.

SADs is usually suddenly death of a sling . I haven’t kept enough avics so I’ll take your word for it.
I’ve seen this on a diversipes and a nhando once , but I doubt sads is real just lack of humidity or too much. Poor care , I’ve seen sudden sling death for no reason but in larger spider it’s usually an bad molt , or a fall post molt.

Get a pic of its front pedipalp is it male or female??? I don’t see much webbing unusual for avic

 

[Thekla]

I thought SADS implies that the tarantula has been over misted and choked to death in water vapor.

SADs is usually suddenly death of a sling . I haven’t kept enough avics so I’ll take your word for it.

SADS (or "Sudden Avic Death Syndrome") is an invented term for something that - we know now - was caused by poor husbandry (like low ventilation and too much humidity), but it's not an official scientifically proofed term for something that really exists. People just called it that way, because they needed a name for what happened to their Avics.

 

[Arachnophoric]

View attachment 281239 View attachment 281240
My A Avic hasn't eaten in a month and this position it's in is worrying. I know the first thing at least a couple of you guys think is, "Oh boy, here's another amateur keeper who's been overmisting and is gonna unknowingly kill it's and it'll be written off as another case of SADS". And while I am an amateur keeper (probably even lower actually), I did enough research to know that moisture and stuffy enclosures kills Avics. As you can see in the six months I've had it it hasn't webbed in the slightest. Or molted. And while I've considered premolt as the cause of it's fast I also tried to introduce dubia roaches about 2 weeks ago and have fed nothing else. It has eaten none of them and 2 are hiding in it's enclosure. I should've reverted back to crickets, I'm stupid, I know. Anyway someone please help. I love watching this thing and I'm really worried. And here's a picture of it's whole enclosure, maybe it's too small, idk.
View attachment 281242

There's nothing worrisome about the position your T is sitting it. Looks entirely normal to me, perhaps a little stressed though. Probably from the dubia in there pestering it, you should try to get those out of there as soon as possible.

It's interesting that it hasn't webbed up anything, although my A. avic female has done something similar herself - went about a month without webbing, finally made a beautiful web tube, only to turn around and destroy it right after molting. She now spends her time usually hanging out on the sides of her enclosure, despite having plenty of opportunity to make webbing. If your T has suddenly stopped eating for the last month, it is possible that it IS in fact in premolt. With larger Ts, premolt + the molting process will last longer than it does with their younger/smaller counterparts. Just make sure your T has access to fresh water and that your enclosure has decent ventilation, and you should be good to go.

SADS (or "Sudden Avic Death Syndrome") is an invented term for something that - we know now - was caused by poor husbandry (like low ventilation and too much humidity), but it's not an official scientifically proofed term for something that really exists. People just called it that way, because they needed a name for what happened to their Avics.

Specifically it was a term used to describe - as the acronym would suggest - when someone's Avic seemingly died "out of nowhere". But as Thelka says, we're now aware it (the seemingly random death of otherwise healthy Avics) was caused by the belief that this genus NEEDED very high humidity and moist conditions. Quite unfortunate that people came to that conclusion when their needs are actually the complete opposite, and ended up wrongly labeling Avics as an overly sensitive/delicate genus.

 

[warhorse333]

I'll work on getting a picture of it's pedipalps, but while I'm here I want to report a somewhat related problem instead of making a new thread. I found these buggers in the same enclosure.

I have no idea what they are and I only realized they were there after noticing the substrate shift, then I scanned the enclosure and found more on the cork bark.

I forgot to say that the tarantula is looking better, as you can see it's hanging on the corkbark. I'm not gonna bother it anymore as I think I scared it with the flash:

I also caught one of the worm things. I saw some in holes in the corkbark. I however don't know if the holes were there prior to the infestation or if the worm things created the holes themselves. I also don't know how they got there. Please help, again.

 

[Arachnophoric]

I forgot to say that the tarantula is looking better, as you can see it's hanging on the corkbark. I'm not gonna bother it anymore as I think I scared it with the flash: View attachment 281476

I also caught one of the worm things. I saw some in holes in the corkbark. I however don't know if the holes were there prior to the infestation or if the worm things created the holes themselves. I also don't know how they got there. Please help, again.
View attachment 281477

Your T definitely looks very leggy, I wouldn't be surprised if it's a MM.

Those worms appear to be mealworms, and if they're just wandering around in the enclosure there's a good chance that there are a lot more in the substrate. They can be a hazard to a molting T and you should probably go ahead and do a full clean of the enclosure, as they'll likely be a nuisance to your T. Not sure how they could possibly get in there without you knowing, as the only possible scenario I can think of is that you attempted feeding some mealworms to your T that escaped into the sub, pupated into beetles, bred and laid eggs in the substrate. Unless they were somehow already in the substrate when you set up the enclosure and have been in there for the last six months you've had the T, but I'd still have thought you'd notice before now. Or maybe you got the T with the enclosure? That's very curious, indeed.

 

[warhorse333]

Your T definitely looks very leggy, I wouldn't be surprised if it's a MM.

Those worms appear to be mealworms, and if they're just wandering around in the enclosure there's a good chance that there are a lot more in the substrate. They can be a hazard to a molting T and you should probably go ahead and do a full clean of the enclosure, as they'll likely be a nuisance to your T. Not sure how they could possibly get in there without you knowing, as the only possible scenario I can think of is that you attempted feeding some mealworms to your T that escaped into the sub, pupated into beetles, bred and laid eggs in the substrate. Unless they were somehow already in the substrate when you set up the enclosure and have been in there for the last six months you've had the T, but I'd still have thought you'd notice before now. Or maybe you got the T with the enclosure? That's very curious, indeed.

I doubt it's mealworms, considering the number and size of them, as I don't know
what they'd eat to get that big. I also haven't really fed it many mealworms, mostly crickets and always try to remove food it refuses. I'm hoping it's not a MM, as want to have this T for a while. When I bought this guy from the store I purposely picked the smallest one they offered to try and extend the time I get to spend with it.
My little brother also reported opening the enclosure some time ago and saw some fruit flies fly out. Idk how they got in there either, but they might have birthed this current problem.
Tomorrow I'm gonna get more crickets and see if my T just simply refuses to eat dubias. If he does turn out to not have a taste for dubias idk what I'm gonna do with my dubia roach colony.

 

[Arachnophoric]

I doubt it's mealworms, considering the number and size of them, as I don't know
what they'd eat to get that big. I also haven't really fed it many mealworms, mostly crickets and always try to remove food it refuses. I'm hoping it's not a MM, as want to have this T for a while. When I bought this guy from the store I purposely picked the smallest one they offered to try and extend the time I get to spend with it.
My little brother also reported opening the enclosure some time ago and saw some fruit flies fly out. Idk how they got in there either, but they might have birthed this current problem.
Tomorrow I'm gonna get more crickets and see if my T just simply refuses to eat dubias. If he does turn out to not have a taste for dubias idk what I'm gonna do with my dubia roach colony.

Those are definitely not from fruit flies, I'd bet my left foot those are mealworms. They look to be the same size as a mealworm, perhaps you're thinking of a superworm?

Fingers crossed for you that it isn't a MM. I still recommend doing a full clean of the enclosure to make sure there aren't any more worms in your substrate, again as they may harass your T if it isn't a MM and tries to molt, or may continue to pupate into beetles and breed.

 

[tewebag]

Fruit fly larva are small and whiteish yellow, similar to maggots from flies. Saying that they appear to be too transparent to be mealworms more than likely some kind of wood boring beetle larvae that somehow got in there, exact type I couldn't tell you.

*edit* if they are all indeed mealworms, you suck at feeding your tarantula and need to seriously change how you are doing it. You don't get that many loose by accident.

 

[warhorse333]

Those are definitely not from fruit flies, I'd bet my left foot those are mealworms. They look to be the same size as a mealworm, perhaps you're thinking of a superworm?

Fingers crossed for you that it isn't a MM. I still recommend doing a full clean of the enclosure to make sure there aren't any more worms in your substrate, again as they may harass your T if it isn't a MM and tries to molt, or may continue to pupate into beetles and breed.

I'm gonna be gone for 10 days starting Saturday, so I tomorrow I'll manage to fit some time in to buy some crickets. I'll see if my T goes for it and if it does I'll assume it's not in premolt and just refusing dubias, thus leading me to clean it's substrate someother time. If it doesn't I'll assume it's in premolt or a MM on it's last legs, and clean out the substrate right away. Does that sound good?

 

[Arachnophoric]

I'm gonna be gone for 10 days starting Saturday, so I tomorrow I'll manage to fit some time in to buy some crickets. I'll see if my T goes for it and if it does I'll assume it's not in premolt and just refusing dubias, thus leading me to clean it's substrate someother time. If it doesn't I'll assume it's in premolt or a MM on it's last legs, and clean out the substrate right away. Does that sound good?

I wouldn't wait to change the substrate regardless of whether or not it eats. Personally, I would have changed out the substrate as soon as I noticed the worms (and dubia) were loose in there. Unless it's springtails or something my T eats within 24 hours, I don't want it left in the enclosure. And taking the T out for cleaning would give you a chance to get us some good shots of the T/its pedipalps so we could lay to rest whether or not your T is a MM. I actually doubt premolt is the cause of its fasting, as its abdomen doesn't look anywhere near plump enough for it to be ready to molt.

 

[warhorse333]

I wouldn't wait to change the substrate regardless of whether or not it eats. Personally, I would have changed out the substrate as soon as I noticed the worms (and dubia) were loose in there. Unless it's springtails or something my T eats within 24 hours, I don't want it left in the enclosure. And taking the T out for cleaning would give you a chance to get us some good shots of the T/its pedipalps so we could lay to rest whether or not your T is a MM. I actually doubt premolt is the cause of its fasting, as its abdomen doesn't look anywhere near plump enough for it to be ready to do so.

How would I go about changing the substrate considering the enclosure? Do I just rip out the corkbark that my T has settled in? It's been glued to the wall of the enclosure, so that's not gonna be easy. I also don't want to stress the T at all if possible and I don't know if I should let it acclimate to the new substrate before having it fed again. I do however really want to get rid of the pests in it's enclosure.

 

[Arachnophoric]

How would I go about changing the substrate considering the enclosure? Do I just rip out the corkbark that my T has settled in? It's been glued to the wall of the enclosure, so that's not gonna be easy. I also don't want to stress the T at all if possible and I don't know if I should let it acclimate to the new substrate before having it fed again. I do however really want to get rid of the pests in it's enclosure.

That's the downside to gluing things in an enclosure, when something like this happens and you have to clean it. Fortunately your T hasn't webbed it all up though, so it's not like you'd be destroying its webbing. IME glue from hot glue guns come off of smooth plastic/glass surfaces pretty easy. Just be careful, try removing your T first to avoid possibly hurting it. You can always glue it back up after you're done, just give it some time to cool/settle before reintroducing the T.

Getting in there to remove your T will likely stress it out a little, but five minutes of stress while you catch cup it and clean out the enclosure would be much better than leaving it in with feeders harassing it over the course of 10 days while you're gone. I might be a bit more paranoid about that stuff than others, though.

As far as feeding goes, you'd be fine offering it food after you put it back in the enclosure. Maybe give it an hour or so to adjust. I've had a good number of Ts shipped to me eat within minutes of being moved from a shipping container to their enclosures.

 

[Ultum4Spiderz]

I'll work on getting a picture of it's pedipalps, but while I'm here I want to report a somewhat related problem instead of making a new thread. I found these buggers in the same enclosure.
View attachment 281474
I have no idea what they are and I only realized they were there after noticing the substrate shift, then I scanned the enclosure and found more on the cork bark.

Gotta be mealworms, can’t think of anything else else. I’ve had Ts from pet store look like female and mature into MM. Size isn’t always reliable, male or female is 4-6”.
when they actually sold avics.
always look at pedipalps if it’s a full grown T , I’ve seen avics mature at 4” to 5.5”