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Starting a Haplo thread ! I would like some help from the Pros - would like to clarify a few things

Discussion in 'Tarantula Questions & Discussions' started by arachnidsrva, Apr 14, 2012.

  1. arachnidsrva

    arachnidsrva Arachnoknight

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    Haplopelma longipes vs. H von wirthi vs. H minax

    They are extremely similar, what are the most obvious differing characteristics?
    I've been struggling recently.... haha


    maybe we can remove some doubt for people in the future that otherwise have no idea sometimes like myself.

    sometimes i have a hard time labeling them - (especially if they haven't molted in a while)
     
  2. Lopez

    Lopez Arachnoking Old Timer

    Haplopelma vonwirthi and Haplopelma minax are very, very, very similar. So similar one could argue they could be the same species, but that's not my call to make.

    Haplopelma longipes are very different to the above two species, visually speaking. They, like minax, have a wide spread of colour forms/hues.

    I will illustrate with some pictures:

    Premoult minax
    [​IMG]

    Postmoult minax (different specimen)
    [​IMG]

    Premoult vonworthi
    [​IMG]

    A different premoult vonworthi
    [​IMG]

    Postmoult vonworthi
    [​IMG]

    Premoult longipes
    [​IMG]

    longipes exuvium (note the size of leg IV and the length relation of legs I and IV, and also the scopula on leg IV)
    [​IMG]

    Postmoult longipes
    [​IMG]
     
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  3. syndicate

    syndicate Arachnoemperor Old Timer

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    I've noticed that sp."Vietnam/Vonwirthi" tends to have more pronounced leg striation then real minax,More pronounced tiger striping on abdomen(in adults) and often reddish or brown colored spinnerets.
    I believe the minax I am keeping here originates from Thailand but they have a large range and it is my understanding there is regional variants of this species found in other areas of South East Asia.Real Haplopelma minax are also extremely rare in the US tarantula hobby but are often sold as such when people don't take the time to Id there stock correctly!Sadly this is often the case with many Haplopelma species!

    Haplopelma minax

    [​IMG]


    -Chris
     
    Last edited: Apr 14, 2012
    • Like Like x 4
  4. arachnidsrva

    arachnidsrva Arachnoknight

    hahahaha. i appreciate the photos that you posted. but now i am further confused - the fourth image down from the bottom looks so much like a H. schmidti

    did you take those yourself? or did you grab them off of the web? so now I am further lost into the abyss of the unknown


    i guess what I need to do is start taking some of my collection out and shooting before/after molting stages and variations between color, but of the same specimens

    i don't know what to think about keeping haplo's now. i have so many variations but I am often confused as to what comes in - which makes me hesitant about labeling/selling any of it either.
     
  5. arachnidsrva

    arachnidsrva Arachnoknight

    Haplopelma images - H. schmidti

    schmidti.jpg h-schmidti.jpg

    H. schmidti - this one is fairly easy to determine - unless that picture you posted really is a H. schmidti
     
    Last edited: Apr 16, 2012
  6. arachnidsrva

    arachnidsrva Arachnoknight

  7. arachnidsrva

    arachnidsrva Arachnoknight

    H. von wirthi - better pictures

    _DSC0137.jpg _DSC0138.jpg
     

    Attached Files:

  8. Lopez

    Lopez Arachnoking Old Timer

    Yes, all the pictures are mine and show my spiders. H.longipes could never be confused with H.schmidti in my view - H.longipes lacks the pronounced cheliceral beard of H.schmidti, it also has the wrong leg length ratio, and the pronounced femoral gold brushes of setae that schmidti has. You need to look past colour....
     
    • Like Like x 1
  9. arachnidsrva

    arachnidsrva Arachnoknight

    Okay I have a great idea. I will shoot single pictures of each of the following - H. longipes - H. minax - H. von wirthi -

    We can make little identification arrows to the different sections of the T's with informational bubbles

    Lopez I am really looking forward to this!
     
  10. jbm150

    jbm150 Arachnoprince

    It's best to be as transparent as possible. Maybe not from a "move the T as fast as possible" view but from an ethical business practice. I know as a customer, I want to know exactly what I'm getting when I buy (or as close as possible). I really appreciate you taking the time and effort to try to learn to key out the species you sell. And I'm interested because I love Haplos :)
     
    • Like Like x 1
  11. Lopez

    Lopez Arachnoking Old Timer

    With regards to your longipes/schmidti confusion:

    [​IMG][​IMG]

    Starting at the front:
    longipes - Leg I clearly shorter than leg IV
    schmidti - Leg I clearly longer than leg IV with extremely robust femurs

    longipes - Leg I & II no dense brush of hairs
    schmidti - Leg I & II have a clearly visible dense brush of golf hairs, particularly noticeable on Leg II in this picture

    longipes - short, dense "beard" (sideburns really) on the outer edge of the chelicerae
    schmidti - long, fuzzy "beard" on the outer edge of the chelicerae. Not overly clear in this picture

    longipes - Leg IV robust with a tuft of hair on the metatarsus. Enlarged scopula pads underneath leg IV
    schmidti - Leg IV reasonably slender with no tuft of hair on the metatarasus. Scopula pads underneath leg IV not particularly pronounced

    longipes - abdomen "normally" shaped
    schmidti - abdomen squat, almost squared off at the spinnerets

    In addition to the above, the habitus is different - schmidti is a far stockier, more robust spider than longipes.
     
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  12. jayefbe

    jayefbe Arachnoprince

    Maybe while on this "correctly identifying individuals" kick (this thread and http://www.arachnoboards.com/ab/sho...tes-hercules&p=2023426&viewfull=1#post2023426) you could also figure out what you were selling as Cyriopagopus thorelli. According to everything I've read, C. thorelli isn't in the hobby.

    http://www.arachnoboards.com/ab/sho...edtei-thorelli&p=173555&viewfull=1#post173555

    It may just be me, but your Cyriopagopus thorelli look quite different from Cyriopagopus I've seen.

    http://arachnidsrva.com/tarantulas-for-sale-2/cyriopagopus-thorelli-malaysian-earthtiger-2/


    Exactly.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  13. BrettG

    BrettG Arachnoprince

    Isn't thorelli now schoiedetei( or however it is spelled)
     
  14. arachnidsrva

    arachnidsrva Arachnoknight

    i removed it from the site - when these came in labled "malaysian earth tiger" with a sharpe marker - they later then molted and turned into ...surprise surprise

    Haplopelma albostriata - thanks for reminding me to remove that!

    I need to get un-lazy and add the rest
     
  15. Lopez

    Lopez Arachnoking Old Timer

    No - all pet trade material sold as C.thorelli that has been examined is actually C.schioedtei.

    C.thorelli remains a valid species for now - it just isn't in the hobby.
     
  16. jbm150

    jbm150 Arachnoprince

    This is true. Here's a pic of an actual C. thorelli from Rick West's site

    Looks kinda like a Borneo black with thinner legs
     
  17. BrettG

    BrettG Arachnoprince

    Awesome. Thanks for the info!
     
  18. jayefbe

    jayefbe Arachnoprince

    Yup, I wish they were in the hobby, I'd be first in line for them.

    Glad to hear you were able to identify them. That's quite a transformation, H. albostriatum wouldn't have been high on my list of guesses.
     
  19. arachnidsrva

    arachnidsrva Arachnoknight

    i"ll try and snap a before/after picture of the same specimen - it's amazing how much that one changed between one molt
     
  20. LV-426

    LV-426 Arachnobaron

    Now that's one bad mama jama of a T.