Role of large pet store chains in the hobby

Did you enter the hobby with a T purchase from PetCo or PetSmart?

  • Yes, with an Avicularia avicularia

    Votes: 2 3.8%
  • Yes, with a Grammostola porteri or Grammostola rosea

    Votes: 9 17.3%
  • No, with a tarantula of different origin (feel free to elaborate)

    Votes: 41 78.8%

  • Total voters
    52
  • Poll closed .

TomM

Arachnobaron of Pennsylvania
Old Timer
Joined
Oct 15, 2009
Messages
448
I got my first tarantula (the Aphonopelma hentzi in my avatar) from Ken the Bug Guy back in 2009 when she was only about a half inch DLS. Now she's around 3.75 - 4 inches about 7 years later. Now I understand what slow growing means. My second and third tarantulas came a week later (B. smithi sling and L. parahybana juvenile). The LP got up to around 7.5" in only 2 years.
 

Bugmom

Arachnolord
Joined
May 28, 2012
Messages
646
I think the results of a poll on Arachnoboards are going to be skewed in favor of people who have or want more than one tarantula, who are "hobbyists," as opposed to people who picked up a tarantula at Petco or Petsmart and that's their one and only tarantula. If it was a Grammastola or some other hardy specimen, chances are the tarantula is doing okay and the owner has no reason to go onto a site like Arachnoboards for advice. I mean, G. rosea is dang near bulletproof. The people who come onto Arachnoboards are *into arachnids,* which is different than simply owning a tarantula.
 

Starantula

Arachnopeon
Joined
Dec 24, 2015
Messages
9
Well when I was a kid and wasn't allowed a T our then equivalent (PetCity) of your petsmart/co carried arachnids. Now, some of the newer chains (Pets at Home, Jollyees) don't...and honestly, caring about the hobby and tarantulas as much as I do, I'm glad because I could only imagine how poorly they'd be cared for in the pursuit of profit. The only big chain I know of in the UK that still sell arachnids is Seapets...but horrendously over priced. Our first, a juvie B. Albo, was from a local independent store. They're not perfect and over priced but I'd trust them far more with Ts and knowledge than the big chain companies.
 
Last edited:

Steve123

Arachnosquire
Arachnosupporter +
Joined
Sep 19, 2013
Messages
87
I think the results of a poll on Arachnoboards are going to be skewed in favor of people who have or want more than one tarantula, who are "hobbyists," as opposed to people who picked up a tarantula at Petco or Petsmart and that's their one and only tarantula. If it was a Grammastola or some other hardy specimen, chances are the tarantula is doing okay and the owner has no reason to go onto a site like Arachnoboards for advice. I mean, G. rosea is dang near bulletproof. The people who come onto Arachnoboards are *into arachnids,* which is different than simply owning a tarantula.
Let's think this through. True, most of us have more than one tarantula. I'm in the thousands if you count spiderlings. On the other hand, nearly all of us started with one tarantula, myself included, and it is that tarantula I'm interested in hearing about.

I'm persuaded there is strong bias in this poll, rendering it useless as far as it's goal. Just a quick scan over recent posts shows no participation by relative newcomers with a first T, an Avic. avic. asking for help, etc.: theghost910, Hakslince, PNWKeith, cream cheese, and so on. I can only speculate as to why.

My tentative conclusion is that whether from a LPS, PC or PS, WC Avicularia avicularia and WC Grammostola spp. (thank you Jose for pointing out the change in demographics post Chile ban), are often chosen first, or at least early on, in most hobbyist's careers. As the two species first stated in this post have been imported in large numbers for decades, pet stores of any size would have wholesale access to them. Members have spoken about Brachypelma albopilosum as being a better first tarantula. I'd have to agree. It has the tank characteristics of Grammostola, but is much easier to breed (should the hobbyist want to venture in that direction), and it doesn't have the fragility of WC Avicularia avicularia, 95% of which I suspect die within months of import, whether on the pet shore shelf or in the hobbyist's hands. The experienced who buy them for rescue I'd predict have a much higher success rate.

Cheers all, and thanks for participating.
-Steve
 

cream cheese

Arachnopeon
Joined
Jan 13, 2016
Messages
14
My actual first tarantula was a sling from Jamie's Tarantulas but I didn't realise how small (and kinda boring) it would actually be and my feeder roaches I bought were growing faster than the little baby, so I picked up an avic at petsmart to help eat them.
 

Steve123

Arachnosquire
Arachnosupporter +
Joined
Sep 19, 2013
Messages
87
My actual first tarantula was a sling from Jamie's Tarantulas but I didn't realise how small (and kinda boring) it would actually be and my feeder roaches I bought were growing faster than the little baby, so I picked up an avic at petsmart to help eat them.
Lol @cream cheese, sometimes I spend a lot of time fussing over roaches just because they are a fun diversion. I should have directed the post to tarantulas purchased early on in the hobbyist's career, among other things I might have changed with what I've learned from member's responses in this thread.
 

Andrea82

Arachnoemperor
Joined
Jan 12, 2016
Messages
3,685
Maybe if you rephrased and or separated the questions,you could get more defined answers. Or add a shout out to the newbies.
There are different questions in your poll,merged into one,imo ;

What was your first T?
Was a chaco or a rosea your first T?
Did you buy it at (insert large petstore name here), or did you buy it somewhere else?
These are the questions I see merged in your poll.;)
 

Exoskeleton Invertebrates

Arachnoprince
Old Timer
Joined
Jun 17, 2007
Messages
1,101
I found Steve's question pretty simple, I just think some members do like to add a bit more into their post that is of topic and that's when threads gets de-rail to a point of no return to the main subject. I know I've done it a couple of times on certain threads in the past. That's just my opinion though.
 
Last edited:

jiacovazzi

Arachnoknight
Joined
Aug 14, 2014
Messages
163
I found Steve's question pretty simple, I just think some members do like to add a bit more into their post that is of topic and that's when threads gets de-rail to a point of no return to the main subject. I know I've done it a couple of times on certain threads in the past. That's just my opinion though.
@Poec54
 

jiacovazzi

Arachnoknight
Joined
Aug 14, 2014
Messages
163
My first T was a small rose hair female from Petco, 18 years ago. Soon after I started attending reptile shows and talking to vendors. I got an Aphonopelma sp. New River which I still have, and a gbb.

Now, collection is into the hundreds :)
 

Steve123

Arachnosquire
Arachnosupporter +
Joined
Sep 19, 2013
Messages
87
Maybe if you rephrased and or separated the questions,you could get more defined answers. Or add a shout out to the newbies.
There are different questions in your poll,merged into one,imo ;

What was your first T?
Was a chaco or a rosea your first T?
Did you buy it at (insert large petstore name here), or did you buy it somewhere else?
These are the questions I see merged in your poll.;)
@Andrea82 - If I could to do it again, based on what I've learned, I'd have phrased the post differently. Important I think for all of us to know is that large chains buy from large wholesalers, and large wholesalers can only exist if they WC in the thousands, or at least tens of hundreds, perhaps with the occasional CB inserted due to chance availability. Here is an AB post from 2002 [bold added for emphasis]:
hahaha i work at a petco and i always wondered what exactly we would get in if i ordered a " goliath bird eater ". how big is the fella???? given their price tag retail wise i would want it to be a decent size i guess lol. as for the chain stores carrying exclusively WC spiders idk i've bought/rescued a few ranging from my lovely little P irminia which was a 1 1/2 inch juvi to a male rosie a female rosie and a poorly kept H lividum and i just took advantage of that same 50% sale to get a little 2 1/2 inch B boehmei. it seems to me that is pretty much whatever CalZoo, the distributor has they send out regardless of size, origin or condition. neat spider though, also on a side note is there any real disadvantage or advantage to stirmi vs blondi other than knowing what exactly you own???? e.g. care, temperament ???
Thus, I would have changed the question to "did buy your first T from a large chain store?"

From the above and from reading the responses of those who participated, a reasonable "working hypothesis" is that pet stores in many ways created and expanded this hobby, but more importantly, large chain pet stores in the past 10 years may have contributed greatly to it's growth, simply because they reach more people (the second part especially needs some data to back it up). I erred in thinking G. porteri/rosea and Avic. avic. were the only two species involved. WC T. stirmi (shares Avic. avic.'s locale), WC A. seemanni (Costa Rica/Nicaragua then more recently Guatemala), and other WC Ts have been offered up by WC importers, and thus have ended up on pet store shelves. Africa and S.E. Asia have not been excluded. G. porteri/rosea is/was (was - n.b. Jose's observation regarding new species mislabelled on the shelves post Chile ban) the least expensive and is/was therefore prima facie number one due to lowest cost:
These particular exporters at first stopped shipping because of the ban, but now it seems have risen from the ashes (What is going on over there?). For very little money an importer could/can buy various WC species:
Website: www.andespiders.com Email: andespiders@gmail.com Whatsapp: +56984999072
PRICE LIST 2015
CHILEAN TARANTULAS
Grammostola rosea (RED)
Cephalotorax – Abdomen: 4,0 - 6,0 cm. Usd $ 2,5
Grammostola sp. (MAULE)
Cephalotorax – Abdomen: 4,0 - 6,0 cm. Usd $ 3,50
Euathlus sp. (FIRE)
Cephalotorax – Abdomen: 3,0 - 4,5 cm. Usd $ 5,00
Euathlus truculentus (BEAUTY BLACK)
Cephalotorax – Abdomen: 3,5 - 5,0 cm. Usd $ 7,00
Grammostola porteri (ROSE HAIR)
Cephalotorax – Abdomen: 4,0 - 6,0 cm. Usd $ 2,0
Euathlus pulcherrimaklaasi (BLUE FORM)
Cephalotorax – Abdomen: 4,0 - 6,0 cm. Usd $ 12,00
Euathlus sp. (SMALL YELLOW)
Cephalotorax – Abdomen: 2,5 - 3,5 cm. Usd $ 5,00
Euathlus sp. (VIOLETT)
Cephalotorax – Abdomen: 3,5 - 5,0 cm. Usd $ 10,00
Grammostola sp. (NORTH)
Cephalotorax – Abdomen: 4,0 - 6,0 cm. Usd $ 2,5
Euathlus pulcherrimaklaasi (GREEN FORM)
Cephalotorax – Abdomen: 4,0 - 6,0 cm. Usd $ 12,00
Euathlus sp. (SMALL ORANGE)
Cephalotorax – Abdomen: 2,5 - 3,5 cm. Usd $ 5,00
Euathlus vulpinus ater (TIGER)
Cephalotorax – Abdomen: 4,0 - 6,0 cm. Usd $ 12,00
Grammostola sp. (CONCEPCION)
Cephalotorax – Abdomen: 4,0 - 6,0 cm. Usd $ 3,00
The economics of capitalism being what it is, very little other than a nation-wide Chile ban could stop wholesalers and thus retailers from selling WC Grammostola spp. How wholesalers have bypassed porteri/rosea to sp. Concepcion and sp. North (or Northern Gold) I don't know. Maybe someone can enlighten us.

I found Steve's question pretty simple, I just think some members do like to add a bit more into their post that is of topic and that's when threads gets de-rail to a point of no return to the main subject. I know I've done it a couple of times on certain threads in the past. That's just my opinion though.
Thanks @jose, I thought the question pretty simple too, although with hindsight I suppose it could have been better focussed. Nonetheless, I think we all learned something along the way.
 
Last edited:

Steve123

Arachnosquire
Arachnosupporter +
Joined
Sep 19, 2013
Messages
87
My first T was a small rose hair female from Petco, 18 years ago. Soon after I started attending reptile shows and talking to vendors. I got an Aphonopelma sp. New River which I still have, and a gbb.

Now, collection is into the hundreds :)
Awesome. 18 years ago, just when PetCo started ramping up. You and many other veterans who have posted here indicate that the theory of @Bugmom et al regarding an AB bias towards "hobbyists" vs. single-T owners is not quite on the mark. Sure, many owners will never own more than one T in their life and never hit the boards. I speculate most eventually exit the hobby and don't contribute significantly to hobby growth. They don't help answer the question of how pet stores and pet store chains selling WC Ts have contributed to growth of the hobby. Other single-T owners, at their stage in the hobby, are not often interested in posts much other than those concerning immediate matters related to their single T: what's it doing on its back?, why hasn't it eaten? etc. Everyone has to start somewhere. Is there better data to suggest that the majority of multiple T owners somehow started differently? The number of posts of single-T owners asking for help regarding their first T, often a G. porter/rosea or Avic. avic., argues against AB not being home to a sizable number of single-T owners. The questions are not always life or death matters. Rather than divide T owners into multiple vs. single, perhaps putting them on a spectrum, hobbyists all, is more prudent for the time being.
 
Last edited:

Exoskeleton Invertebrates

Arachnoprince
Old Timer
Joined
Jun 17, 2007
Messages
1,101
Also like to mention in the beginning of the 90's there was also Bryant Capiz (Arachnocentric) some of the old timers might have purchased from Bryant. He was an importer that to me in my opinion was a big impact to the hobby. Now I don't know exactly when he first started his business in Chicago but I'm sure some old timers purchased their first tarantula through Bryant.
 

Poec54

Arachnoemperor
Joined
Mar 26, 2013
Messages
4,745
Also like to mention in the beginning of the 90's there was also Bryant Capiz (Arachnocentric) some of the old timers might have purchased from Bryant. He was an importer that to me in my opinion was a big impact to the hobby. Now I don't know exactly when he first started his business in Chicago but I'm sure some old timers purchased their first tarantula through Bryant.

Bryant was a great guy, very generous. I traded many of the slings I bred with him, so I could get new species. He was a major force in the hobby in the 1990's. He'd come down to the annual Captive Breeders Expo in Orlando, and set up a big display. One year he couldn't make it, and he shipped hundreds of spiders to me so my wife and I could run the booth and sell for him. It's a shame he's not here to see how his tireless efforts have helped to grow the hobby to what it is today.
 

Andrea82

Arachnoemperor
Joined
Jan 12, 2016
Messages
3,685
@Andrea82 - If I could to do it again, based on what I've learned, I'd have phrased the post differently. Important I think for all of us to know is that large chains buy from large wholesalers, and large wholesalers can only exist if they WC in the thousands, or at least tens of hundreds, perhaps with the occasional CB inserted due to chance availability. Here is an AB post from 2002 [bold added for emphasis]:
Thus, I would have changed the question to "did buy your first T from a large chain store?"

From the above and from reading the responses of those who participated, a reasonable "working hypothesis" is that pet stores in many ways created and expanded this hobby, but more importantly, large chain pet stores in the past 10 years may have contributed greatly to it's growth, simply because they reach more people (the second part especially needs some data to back it up). I erred in thinking G. porteri/rosea and Avic. avic. were the only two species involved. WC T. stirmi (shares Avic. avic.'s locale), WC A. seemanni (Costa Rica/Nicaragua then more recently Guatemala), and other WC Ts have been offered up by WC importers, and thus have ended up on pet store shelves. Africa and S.E. Asia have not been excluded. G. porteri/rosea is/was (was - n.b. Jose's observation regarding new species mislabelled on the shelves post Chile ban) the least expensive and is/was therefore prima facie number one due to lowest cost:
These particular exporters at first stopped shipping because of the ban, but now it seems have risen from the ashes (What is going on over there?). For very little money an importer could/can buy various WC species:
Website: www.andespiders.com Email: andespiders@gmail.com Whatsapp: +56984999072
PRICE LIST 2015
CHILEAN TARANTULAS
Grammostola rosea (RED)
Cephalotorax – Abdomen: 4,0 - 6,0 cm. Usd $ 2,5
Grammostola sp. (MAULE)
Cephalotorax – Abdomen: 4,0 - 6,0 cm. Usd $ 3,50
Euathlus sp. (FIRE)
Cephalotorax – Abdomen: 3,0 - 4,5 cm. Usd $ 5,00
Euathlus truculentus (BEAUTY BLACK)
Cephalotorax – Abdomen: 3,5 - 5,0 cm. Usd $ 7,00
Grammostola porteri (ROSE HAIR)
Cephalotorax – Abdomen: 4,0 - 6,0 cm. Usd $ 2,0
Euathlus pulcherrimaklaasi (BLUE FORM)
Cephalotorax – Abdomen: 4,0 - 6,0 cm. Usd $ 12,00
Euathlus sp. (SMALL YELLOW)
Cephalotorax – Abdomen: 2,5 - 3,5 cm. Usd $ 5,00
Euathlus sp. (VIOLETT)
Cephalotorax – Abdomen: 3,5 - 5,0 cm. Usd $ 10,00
Grammostola sp. (NORTH)
Cephalotorax – Abdomen: 4,0 - 6,0 cm. Usd $ 2,5
Euathlus pulcherrimaklaasi (GREEN FORM)
Cephalotorax – Abdomen: 4,0 - 6,0 cm. Usd $ 12,00
Euathlus sp. (SMALL ORANGE)
Cephalotorax – Abdomen: 2,5 - 3,5 cm. Usd $ 5,00
Euathlus vulpinus ater (TIGER)
Cephalotorax – Abdomen: 4,0 - 6,0 cm. Usd $ 12,00
Grammostola sp. (CONCEPCION)
Cephalotorax – Abdomen: 4,0 - 6,0 cm. Usd $ 3,00
The economics of capitalism being what it is, very little other than a nation-wide Chile ban could stop wholesalers and thus retailers from selling WC Grammostola spp. How wholesalers have bypassed porteri/rosea to sp. Concepcion and sp. North (or Northern Gold) I don't know. Maybe someone can enlighten us.



Thanks @jose, I thought the question pretty simple too, although with hindsight I suppose it could have been better focussed. Nonetheless, I think we all learned something along the way.
But you could do it again,that's my point. Jiacovazzi already made a start ;).
Maybe it was the language,but it was not clear to me what it was exactly you were asking. Maybe that for me, 'did you buy your t at a large petstore or not' would have yielded better answers?
About the role large corporations play in WC T's, I have seen a lot about that already in other threads,maybe get the info there?
I'm always interested and curious in research,surveys and new development,that's wht I followed and answered this thread :)
I really hope you'll follow up!
 

Chris LXXIX

ArachnoGod
Joined
Dec 25, 2014
Messages
5,845
And your ongoing vendetta against me continues, apparently the main reason you're on this forum.
I'm fascinated by the use of one of our words, 'Vendetta', by USA people. 'Vendetta' sounds more cool than 'Revenge'.
 

Andrea82

Arachnoemperor
Joined
Jan 12, 2016
Messages
3,685
E="Chris LXXIX, post: 2435537, member: 106805"]I'm fascinated by the use of one of our words, 'Vendetta', by USA people. 'Vendetta' sounds more cool than 'Revenge'.[/QUOTE]
Doesn't vendetta mean something more than revenge? I thought it was more like 'blood feud'? Im no expert in Italian though lol.
 

Chris LXXIX

ArachnoGod
Joined
Dec 25, 2014
Messages
5,845
Doesn't vendetta mean something more than revenge? I thought it was more like 'blood feud'? Im no expert in Italian though lol.
We always used/use "Vendetta" for state "Revenge". "Blood feud" isn't used, only "Faida" but without mentioning the 'blood' part, because we know prior that blood is always involved, so we do not specify that. But "Feud" here is used mostly when those acts happens in the Southern part of the boot, where "families" hit very hard... and those acts lasts even for decades, notably even exporting those, like in Duisburg, Germany, ah ah... you never know what's inside a wall when you drill holes in some Regions like Calabria, lol, no joking; vendetta, on the other hand, is used for state a "revenge" that someone do against someone/something.
 
Last edited:
Top