Really big problem, need help!

[Talkenlate04]

Is there any evidence that Dyskinetic Syndrome is contagious?

I have now what seems to be 20 or so spiders affected, 4 dead, and at least 8 more that will be gone very soon. Several species as well. But at this point nothing but slings, the largest being a 2.5" ornata.

There have been no diet changes,
There have been no diet changes for the roaches ether.

I am really worried about this. I have never faced a problem this scary. I will post video when I can.

 

[clearlysaid]

Ryan, from what I've read it seems like if one tarantula in a collection gets it, other start to exhibit the symptoms, too. That would lead me to believe it is contagious. Not sure how it would spread... or how it got started to begin with.

Have you quarantined the ones who have it?

Could it be a chemical reaction and not DS? Maybe they came into contact w/ pesticides or something else, instead...?

 

[matthias]

http://www.arachnoboards.com/ab/showthread.php?t=17135

Only think I could find quickly and it is fairly old.

It suggests the transition is from crickets or food source.
I would isolate those slings as must as possible. Possibly the whole sac.
I would also really examine your roaches maybe even delay feeding for a little while to see is something happens to them.

I'll keep looking to see if I can find anything else.

 

[clearlysaid]

I know roaches are quite resilient little creatures. I've read they can be carrier of diseases while not directly affected themselves; who knows if that really is true, though...? It could be possible the roaches do have DS, if DS is the problem... and that is how it is spreading. I personally would be hesitant to feed them off anymore. I know that sucks considering how long it takes to start a colony but I'd rather be safe than sorry. May be extreme, though...

 

[Talkenlate04]

The roaches are thriving. No unusual deaths in the colony or anything like that. The adult Ts have all been fed well in the recent weeks and are not showing any signs at all of being affected. So far we are restricted to the sling level only. I just finished removing all found with the symptoms, and I am debating on freezing them right now.
And there have been no chemicals introduced both inside or out side of my T room.

 

[Talkenlate04]

Here is video of one of the slings.

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[Kris-wIth-a-K]

hmm

Could it be some kind of bacteria some roaches picked up from maybe some of the dead roaches that were eaten?

 

[Talkenlate04]

Could it be some kind of bacteria some roaches picked up from maybe some of the dead roaches that were eaten?

Not a whole lot of roach eating roach action in my colony. I check them daily, and remove the ones that are slowing down. So I am not sure if that would be a factor or not.

 

[verry_sweet]

Awww no!! Sorry to hear about the little guys. I lost a little chaco not so long ago to it and it’s absolutely heart wrenching to watch them deteriorate. As far as I can tell no other T was inflicted in my spider room.

I’m curious. Did they seem unhappy in their enclosures at all that you know off? I know you have a lot of little ones to look after but I’m trying to find similarities in reported cases. Thanx man…

 

[RottweilExpress]

Is that one in an early stage? It doesn't look really like I remember seing other individuals move on the net. Something is clearly wrong though and I'm so sorry for you and your animals.

 

[Talkenlate04]

They all became effected so fast there was no sign really. The first one I found yesterday, and I froze him right away and threw out the vial substrate and all. But today when I came home there were quite a few more with the symptoms.

I have the windows open, airing out the room, and I am starting to wipe everything down with a mild dish soap solution.

At this point I think I am going to freeze every one that has the symptoms right away, I have to many T's to risk trying to risk more spreading.

Is that one in an early stage? It doesn't look really like I remember seing other individuals move on the net. Something is clearly wrong though and I'm so sorry for you and your animals.

The one in the video is just starting. The others are already clutching mouthfuls of substrate and barely moving now. Some of them are even biting their own legs off before dying.

 

[cheetah13mo]

Ryan, from what I've read it seems like if one tarantula in a collection gets it, other start to exhibit the symptoms, too. That would lead me to believe it is contagious. Not sure how it would spread... or how it got started to begin with.

Have you quarantined the ones who have it?

Could it be a chemical reaction and not DS? Maybe they came into contact w/ pesticides or something else, instead...?

What ever D.S. is, it is not contageous. I've had it with a few of my T's and I never isolated them and it did not spread. The D. S. symptoms developed at different times so it is a condition that the T developes and does not inherit. I had a P. scrofa sling develope it and that T is the only one that, over a few molts, made it back to full health as a mature male. All I did was increase the water avalibility in it's container and I think I caught it before it got bad. The other five died within 6 month of showing the symptoms. I, in no way shape or form, have anything to back any of this up but only with my own experieces and observations. What I've come up with is prolonged stress cause by an invirenment that is not fitting for the T or the T just didn't like and it was not changed in a timely fashion. Both, my P. scrofa and P. rufilata, were purchased when I was only 6 months into the hobby and seeing them more active was nice but now knowing they were stressed, I think, ended up costing them thier lives. I've also had a couple of mature males develope D.S. and I believe just being in captivity, not able to hunt for females, added a enormeous amount of stress to them. I also think my female G. rosea and my female A. versicolor developed D.S. because I left thier envirenments too dry with too little water to drink. Both died quite rapidly. The addition of moisture and more water initiated the desire to drink but they were both too far gone to do it. Keeping all of my arboreal T's in the same type of containers and in the same design setups, eating the same kind of food from the same boxes, drinking the same water from the same source, living on the same subsrate from the same bag and staying in the same room, under the same conditions, tells me it was their envirenmental conditions. The others never developed it because once the A. versi did, I raised the humidity level for all my arboreals so they got taken care of before anything set in. That was the only change I made and I'm sure there would have been others if I had kept them in those conditions, without any change. Each species of T has certain requirements that need to be met, just like each rosie can have a drastically different attitude (some nice, some devil spawn) so I feel it is very important to pay close attention to each individual T's behaivior and make adjustment in a timely manner to see what the T respondes well to. As I said, I never did isolate any of them and I was able to make adjustments based on this theory and I have not had a T develope D. S. in almost 16 months. There is no sience behind what I'm saying, just my own logic so take all of this just as it is, my own expirience. If anyone has any questions for me, I'll answer them the best I can because I'd love to be able to compare notes and maybe we can figure something out. I hope this helps.

 

[Talkenlate04]

Cheetah,

There is spreading, but in no real pattern. It's effecting Ts that are all in the same setups. But on one table on the left there were three vials with them, nothing on the whole rest of the table, but 7 more on the right side of the table 5 feet over. And they are all in the exact same setups, fed the exact same food, and exposed to the exact same temps and humidity.

An additional note...... these guys are not living long after they get the symptoms.

 

[Nich]

Sounds like poisoning to me. Regaurdless of known exposure.

 

[cheetah13mo]

I'm going to assume your T's do not have the same thing mine did then because my T's got them one at a time, at different times. There might be different types of this D.S. IF they were all kept the same way, in the same room, fed the same things and exposed to the same envirenmental situations, couldn't the symptoms develope at the same time without being contageous?

 

[AubZ]

I would also like to add my personal experience in hopes we can find answers to this.
I had an A amazoniza from about 2nd or 3rd instar. It got to about 3in+ and I left a meal worm in it's webbing. I forgot about leaving the worm in there and thought that my T would have eaten it. When I opened a few days later I discovered a decayed worm and mites. This was my first and last (I hope) experience with mites. I immediately removed her and looked for a couple hours if she had any on her. I could not see any, so the next day I moved her into her new home. About a week or 2 later I found that she was just sitting on her substrate not moving. When I tried to move her, she displayed D.S. Just not as active as Ryan's vid. I then 2 or 3 days later found her on her back next to the water dish. She was not molting or anything like that, she was dead. I tried to flip her over, but nothing.
I had her in a small cabinet along with another 15+ T's all around her and fortunately none of them displayed any of the symptoms. This was around 6 months ago. I was really upset as I felt that I had killed her by not removing that worm. Today, I leave nothing unchecked.

So I would also like to know if the mites caused it or if it was the stress of being relocated as I never saw any mites on her? Is it a possiblility that some T's have it and can be triggered by certain things? I also feel that it is not contagious, so if that is true, I think you have an even bigger problem Ryan as they must be getting it somewhere.



P.S. So sorry to hear about yours Ryan and I really hope it does not spread any further.

 

[von_z]

That really sucks Ryan. Good luck and keep us posted.

 

[jameshay_1uk]

Oh my god, that video is so heart breaking. I feel so sorry for you and ur guys. I have never heard of this before, it's quite distressing.

I hope that it stops sreading!

Good luck mate

 

[2bears]

food for thought

Just A thought but with spring here I wonder if some one in your neighborhood
has been spraying grass, fruit trees, ect and with home windows open something came in?
Sorry this happen to you and hope things get better fast !
hang in there,
Twobears

 

[betuana]

Eek!

Just A thought but with spring here I wonder if some one in your neighborhood
has been spraying grass, fruit trees, ect and with home windows open something came in?
Sorry this happen to you and hope things get better fast !
hang in there,
Twobears

A bit off topic, but

Wow am I glad I just read that. I've been thinking about opening the windows to my snake/T room to get some fresh air in there, but now I'm second guessing that idea - LOTS of people in our neighborhood seem to like that whole manicured lawn look, and complain about 'pests' etc. I'd be surprised if people around here DIDN'T spray for pests!

Heck, we get termite inspections regularly, and have had to evac. our aquariums, snakes, and other critters (didn't have the T at the time) for full house treatments (we were advised it would potentially be harmful to the tanks and such). Our neighborhood is basically built on a termite mound, so probblems are inevitable.

We don't get regularly sprayed, just inspections and traps, since we don't want our house full of poisons, but I'd be surprised if our immediate next door neighbors (whose house the windows of that room face, and are just 10 feet from their yard) don't spray. They HATE nature as far as I can tell (and to their own profession), they trap squirrels, throw rocks at birds, kick the fence to spook stuff off, and swear and scream at them regularly. We had to get rid of all our bird feeders (and therefore our populations of indigo buntings, goldfinches, grosbeaks, etc - several years and hundreds of dollars of work as well) due to the harassment from them about the 'nasty birds.'

Definitely keeping our windows shut now - I feel kind of silly having not thought of that risk - I had already planned for it we needed treating, but had forgotten to consider the neighbors treating stuff....

Back on topic - that video is heartbreaking! I'm so sorry to hear about your slings. Makes me want to make sure to quarantine all my feeders and inspect them...even considering raising my own (roaches if I were to do that), even though I only have 1 T so far - but even then people have been having problems with roach colonies too it seem. Bleh, reminds me of the pet food recalls a while back, what a mess.

I hope the rest of your T's stay healthy!