Scoly
Arachnobaron
- Joined
- Dec 4, 2013
- Messages
- 488
Jut thought I'd post this as there's scattered bits of info for others.
So I got a Peruvian "viridicornis" in late October (it's now early February) about 13cm and it seemed sluggish, not very alert, and dark of colouration, so we figured it was pre-moult. However it kept on walking around it's cage, and eating, not that much, and sometimes needing help, but then got sharper and more active, so I figured it might not be pre-moult after all. It also groomed itself and itched itself a lot.
A couple of weeks ago I planned to move it to a new enclosure, so wanted to de-mite it first and put it in a jar as I figured out how I was going to do it (using my avocado trick or just a water shake), but then decided I might as well do a full drowning knock out and sex it at the same time. I've drowned many other pedes before, and never had a problem. I'd read one warning about sexing by drowning while pre-moult, but thought if it was going to moult it will have moulted by now, and that was my mistake.
I left it in for 45 min, sexed it, found no sign of mites (so they either came off, or it wasn't itching mites) and then let it recover, but it took absolutely ages to wake up, and I knew I'd screwed up. I left it overnight, and in the morning it was sluggish, had its maxilipeds hanging open, the head and first two segments seemed paralysed, so that they were being dragged around or pushed into the ground when moving forward. It's mandibles hanging out (antennae working, but oddly), and the two front legs were curled inwards, one even turning black at the base over the next few days. Needless to say I was completely gutted.
It stayed like this for a couple of weeks during which I sought help from people who know more than me. One suggestion was to raise the temperature a bit as it was 25 by day and 20 by night, so I bumped it up to 28 on the hot side and overall of 23 at night.
Another suggestion was to drip feed it some very weak saline solution, which can apparently solve problems with invertebrates being depleted of electrolytes, failing which it helps re-hydrate. Others still said there wouldn't be much hope.
The back edge of its head plate turned a lighter colour, and my overall impression was that it was premolt, and water had got in between the old and new skin. It was also doing a weird convulsion, like a very mild cough every few seconds with its head. I've seen pedes do full body coughs after drowning, so maybe it was "flooded" inside, if that makes sense.
The other day she became really sluggish, and I knew she was either going to moult or die, and then finally, last night she moulted, and ate her exuviae, which means her mouth parts are working again! It's still not home and dry as she needs to dry out (100% accidental pun) but fingers crossed she'll pull through, and I'll have a magnificent healthy sub-adult female viridicornis in my care.
Bumping up the temperature seems to have helped one of my E. trigonopodus moult too (they seem to spend ages in pre-moult even though they're at 5-8 cm stage).
So lessons learned:
- Pre-moult can last a long time, during which they may go back to eating, and may even be quite active, unlike T's which seem to be more clear cut (from what I remember).
- Don't use the drowning method to sex pede if you're not 100% sure it's not pre-moult (and even then, favour CO2)
- Don't give up on your pede because it's in a bad state. Ask for advice, try changing the parameters, try re-hydrating, never give up.
I'll post an update in a few days. Thanks to all who helped with advice, you know who you are!
So I got a Peruvian "viridicornis" in late October (it's now early February) about 13cm and it seemed sluggish, not very alert, and dark of colouration, so we figured it was pre-moult. However it kept on walking around it's cage, and eating, not that much, and sometimes needing help, but then got sharper and more active, so I figured it might not be pre-moult after all. It also groomed itself and itched itself a lot.
A couple of weeks ago I planned to move it to a new enclosure, so wanted to de-mite it first and put it in a jar as I figured out how I was going to do it (using my avocado trick or just a water shake), but then decided I might as well do a full drowning knock out and sex it at the same time. I've drowned many other pedes before, and never had a problem. I'd read one warning about sexing by drowning while pre-moult, but thought if it was going to moult it will have moulted by now, and that was my mistake.
I left it in for 45 min, sexed it, found no sign of mites (so they either came off, or it wasn't itching mites) and then let it recover, but it took absolutely ages to wake up, and I knew I'd screwed up. I left it overnight, and in the morning it was sluggish, had its maxilipeds hanging open, the head and first two segments seemed paralysed, so that they were being dragged around or pushed into the ground when moving forward. It's mandibles hanging out (antennae working, but oddly), and the two front legs were curled inwards, one even turning black at the base over the next few days. Needless to say I was completely gutted.
It stayed like this for a couple of weeks during which I sought help from people who know more than me. One suggestion was to raise the temperature a bit as it was 25 by day and 20 by night, so I bumped it up to 28 on the hot side and overall of 23 at night.
Another suggestion was to drip feed it some very weak saline solution, which can apparently solve problems with invertebrates being depleted of electrolytes, failing which it helps re-hydrate. Others still said there wouldn't be much hope.
The back edge of its head plate turned a lighter colour, and my overall impression was that it was premolt, and water had got in between the old and new skin. It was also doing a weird convulsion, like a very mild cough every few seconds with its head. I've seen pedes do full body coughs after drowning, so maybe it was "flooded" inside, if that makes sense.
The other day she became really sluggish, and I knew she was either going to moult or die, and then finally, last night she moulted, and ate her exuviae, which means her mouth parts are working again! It's still not home and dry as she needs to dry out (100% accidental pun) but fingers crossed she'll pull through, and I'll have a magnificent healthy sub-adult female viridicornis in my care.
Bumping up the temperature seems to have helped one of my E. trigonopodus moult too (they seem to spend ages in pre-moult even though they're at 5-8 cm stage).
So lessons learned:
- Pre-moult can last a long time, during which they may go back to eating, and may even be quite active, unlike T's which seem to be more clear cut (from what I remember).
- Don't use the drowning method to sex pede if you're not 100% sure it's not pre-moult (and even then, favour CO2)
- Don't give up on your pede because it's in a bad state. Ask for advice, try changing the parameters, try re-hydrating, never give up.
I'll post an update in a few days. Thanks to all who helped with advice, you know who you are!