Poecilotheria Bara=Poecilotheria Subfusca?

[friendttyy]

I was browsing the internet when I came across thes species P.Bara/Subfusca. I just wanted to know whether the P.Bara is a different specie to the P.Subfusca or are they the same specie?

 

[fyic]

I believe them to be the same……I’m sure some people might debate that but that’s my thought



http://research.amnh.org/iz/spiders/catalog/THERAPHOSIDAE.html

 

[Hydrazine]

Let's wait for Poec54 to weigh in. If he doesn't know, I don't know who would.

 

[friendttyy]

*knocksonpokiesdoor* Meo you know anything about P.Bara and Subfusca
Pokie: *Threatposses* Get away from my place!
I came across this when googling poecilotheria bites and saw poecilotheria bara/subfusca in the drop down.

 

[paassatt]

I believe them to be the same……I’m sure some people might debate that but that’s my thought



http://research.amnh.org/iz/spiders/catalog/THERAPHOSIDAE.html

I don't see much room for debate, honestly. Platnick's World Spider Catalog is a pretty authoritative source. Poecilotheria bara is a junior synonym of Poecilotheria subfusca. It's certain sellers that continue to use P. bara erroneously, not arachnologists.

 

[friendttyy]

So then it means that P.Subfusca IS the same specie as P.Bara.

 

[paassatt]

So then it means that P.Subfusca IS the same specie as P.Bara.

Yes, they are the same. Also, for future reference, "species" is the singular form of the word as well as the plural. "Specie" is a type of coin or hard money. So you would say "this is a species" as well as "these are species".

 

[Poec54]

They're now considered the same species, although in mainland Europe the name bara is still often used. They're native to a mountain range in central Sri Lanka. It appears there's two forms, a small darker one from higher elevations (Nuwara, which is cold and wet year round), and a larger lighter one from medium elevations (Kandy, hot and tropical all year; similar elevation as formosa, ornata, and regalis). That does seem to be a lot of variation within a single species of tarantula (maybe a subspecies distinction may be warranted?). In the hobby there's been no end of confusion between the two, and many are mislabeled, even by dealers. Regardless of what the seller calls it, it may be the other form. Because of this, the two forms inadvertantly get crossed in captive breeding efforts, which may be something that happens rarely, if at all, in the wild. It may be just a matter of time before all of the specimens in this country are a mix of the two forms.

 

[persistent]

I'm from mainland europe and I haven't seen P. bara come up as a name in a long time so I have to disagree on that one Poec54 I see that name come up more often on the american boards actually.
I agree with the rest of your post though

 

[xhexdx]

Yes, they are the same. Also, for future reference, "species" is the singular form of the word as well as the plural. "Specie" is a type of coin or hard money. So you would say "this is a species" as well as "these are species".

Also for future reference...species shouldn't be capitalized, only genus.

Hope you're doing well, paassatt.

Poec54 - great info, thanks.

 

[Hydrazine]

I'm from mainland europe and I haven't seen P. bara come up as a name in a long time so I have to disagree on that one Poec54 I see that name come up more often on the american boards actually.
I agree with the rest of your post though

Perhaps Benelux is more progressive In Czech Rep. and Germany, it's quite common to see "P.bara".

 

[Philth]

I'd have a hard time believing that the HL and LL haven't been mixed for years already.

later, Tom

 

[Ceratogyrus]

I'd have a hard time believing that the HL and LL haven't been mixed for years already.

later, Tom

Agree. I would be surprised if there were any "pure" highland and lowland anymore.

 

[Poec54]

Agree. I would be surprised if there were any "pure" highland and lowland anymore.

If there still are, there probably won't be long term. A large part of it is unintentional, as some of them have been mislabeled when sold and then those crosses circulate in the hobby and are bred. I would think through selective breeding of these mixed individuals in the future (pairing darker ones with other darker ones) that some of (most of?) that could eventually be reversed. But they'll still be a number of 50/50 crosses out there adding to the gene pool.

There's similar situations with accidental captive mixing of B vagans and related species, and some of the Avicularia.

 

[Ceratogyrus]

I've got a definite highland female, but no males that I have seen have even come close to as dark as she is, so guessing I won't see many down here in SA

 

[Poec54]

I've got a definite highland female, but no males that I have seen have even come close to as dark as she is, so guessing I won't see many down here in SA

And that situation has probably led some people to use whatever is available, even if it's a male of the other form.

 

[obtkeeper]

I was browsing the internet when I came across thes species P.Bara/Subfusca. I just wanted to know whether the P.Bara is a different specie to the P.Subfusca or are they the same specie?

I've been told the they split them into two different species, that the P. subfusca is highland, and P. Bara is lowland...

 

[Ceratogyrus]

I've been told the they split them into two different species, that the P. subfusca is highland, and P. Bara is lowland...

Did the person who told you this have any recent papers to back his statement up?

 

[paassatt]

I've been told the they split them into two different species, that the P. subfusca is highland, and P. Bara is lowland...

See post #5 in this thread.

 

[catfishrod69]

Like Philth said, more than likely the two have been mixed many times. Who knows if what we have as a highland, wasnt actually hatched from parents that were highland/lowland. I personally wont cross the two.