Male Singapore Blue and a Gooty hunger strike.

[Cutler]

Hello everyone,

First of all I would like to express my sheer amazement at this incredible resource; the volume of information is overwhelming, but also an exciting opportunity to learn new things with like minded enthusiasts. So I would like to say thank you in advance for any guidance and clarity you may be able to offer me.

Around 18 months ago I discovered, and became actively involved in keeping Tarantulas. I am perhaps guilty of not subscribing to conventional wisdom and acquired a few spiderlings, two of which were a Singapore Blue and Gooty Metallica. Thankfully both thrived under my inexperienced care and are now beautiful representations of their species.

My question is one of two parts: firstly, I am certain that my Singapore Blue is male, but I'm unable to ascertain if he has reached his final moult, although I 'suspect' that to be the case. Due to the design of his enclosure, I don't often get an opportunity to see him close up; he often ventures out once the lights are off and quickly retreats once I enter the room. However, 3 months ago he stopped eating and quickly shed following this hiatus from food, after which he emerged considerably larger with a very faint touch green blended into a predominately brown colouring. This was also accompanied by the presence of previously unobserved bristles covering his legs. On closer inspection I was unable to detect the Tibial Hooks and there was no obvious increase in the size of his Pedipalps. My research has been essentially unsuccessful due to the ambiguous nature of the information I've read; some information suggests the male of this species doesn't have Tibial hooks, whereas other sources suggest they do, but in much smaller dimensions. I would also add that he hasn't eaten anything since that moult and is looking rather frail and under nourished, although still appears to be very active during the night.

Secondly, my Gooty Metallica, although female, has followed an almost identical timeline of moulting and then completely absconding from food. This is very uncharacteristic behaviour for her, as she was previously a very indulgent feeder. In both examples conditions have remained the same in regard to temperature & humidity etc.

I would be very grateful if any members of the board can shed some light on these issues, as I am worried about the welfare of both these Tarantulas. Are there any tips or clues that I've overlooked in determining the sexual maturity of my Singapore Blue, and is there a reason to be concerned about my Gooty Metallica not eating?

Thank you once again for your time and help, it is greatly appreciated.

 

[Chris LXXIX]

Hello there. Poecilotheria metallica aren't exactly the best eaters: they are a bit choosy, especially when it comes to dubia (or roaches in general). Crickets are the best option for those.

As far as i know, MM Lampropelma violaceopes possess tibial apophysis, so check well... it's easy to spot MM.
"Boxing Gloves" always

 

[Cutler]

Hello there. Poecilotheria metallica aren't exactly the best eaters: they are a bit choosy, especially when it comes to dubia (or roaches in general). Crickets are the best option for those.

As far as i know, MM Lampropelma violaceopes possess tibial apophysis, so check well... it's easy to spot MM.
"Boxing Gloves" always

Hello Chris,

Thank you for your prompt and most helpful reply. For the most part have raised my collection of Roaches and Giant meal worms, both regularly, and eagerly, devoured previous to this current problem. I was feeding Crickets for a couple of months during the embryonic stages of becoming involved in the hobby, and although they were a very popular cuisine choice for my Tarantulas, the mite problem became intolerable, despite all efforts to increase ventilation and forensically monitor humidly levels. But I will take your advice and try her with a couple of crickets on Monday. Also thank you so much for clarity on the Singapore Blue. When he materialises I will endeavour to get a closer look.

Very grateful. Thank you.

 

[Chris LXXIX]

Hello Chris,

Thank you for your prompt and most helpful reply. For the most part have raised my collection of Roaches and Giant meal worms, both regularly, and eagerly, devoured previous to this current problem. I was feeding Crickets for a couple of months during the embryonic stages of becoming involved in the hobby, and although they were a very popular cuisine choice for my Tarantulas, the mite problem became intolerable, despite all efforts to increase ventilation and forensically monitor humidly levels. But I will take your advice and try her with a couple of crickets on Monday. Also thank you so much for clarity on the Singapore Blue. When he materialises I will endeavour to get a closer look.

Very grateful. Thank you.

A trick for avoid mites in a cricket enclosure (works pretty well for me) is: a full ventilation enclosure, no substrate, no humidity of all sort save for the "humidity" they get from carrots.

 

[Cutler]

Thank you once again, Chris. The problem I found most intolerable, and at times infuriating, was the manifestation of mites in the actual Tarantula enclosures. This would regularly occur with in a week or two of feeding Crickets and quickly spread to the other enclosures. I would then have to endure the task of rehousing everything, which would sometimes take hours, and become particularly troublesome when negotiating the removal of my Metallica and Salmon Pink. I eliminated this problem after switching to Roaches and Mealworms. But I will return to Crickets in an effort to solve this hunger strike but just move her enclosure to a different area to avoid mite contamination if it happens and decides to spread.

 

[cold blood]

The hunger strike with the poec could very well just be pre-molt. The bigger they get, the more pronounced this period will be. It can last months, and as long as the t is plump and healthy (keeping in mind that arboreals do not plump up in the same enormous manner that most terrestrials do), and as long as there is a water dish that's not dry, fasting periods should be of no concern. Just wait till she emerges, then offer food.

As for the blue, if its a MM it should be obvious, as it will not be purple, but a weird green, which I believe you tried to describe, plus you will notice it will be very very spindly with a seemingly small body and comparatively very long legs. This species you shouldn't even need to be looking for small things like tibial hooks. Assuming it is a MM, they do eat a lot less as their little minds are elsewhere. Good thing is that you don't really need to worry about an escaped prey item, as the t will not molt again to be vulnerable.

 

[Cutler]

The hunger strike with the poec could very well just be pre-molt. The bigger they get, the more pronounced this period will be. It can last months, and as long as the t is plump and healthy (keeping in mind that arboreals do not plump up in the same enormous manner that most terrestrials do), and as long as there is a water dish that's not dry, fasting periods should be of no concern. Just wait till she emerges, then offer food.

As for the blue, if its a MM it should be obvious, as it will not be purple, but a weird green, which I believe you tried to describe, plus you will notice it will be very very spindly with a seemingly small body and comparatively very long legs. This species you shouldn't even need to be looking for small things like tibial hooks. Assuming it is a MM, they do eat a lot less as their little minds are elsewhere. Good thing is that you don't really need to worry about an escaped prey item, as the t will not molt again to be vulnerable.

Thank you for your detailed reply. With regard to the Metallica she hasn't eaten since her last moult, so would the same conditions that you've outlined apply, for example a double moult type scenario?

The description of the Singapore Blue you described is very accurate and he has also failed to eat a single thing since his last moult. I just managed to get a brief glance at him as he was stationed on the glass which enabled me to get a full glance of his under carriage. On this occasion I did notice small red marks which appear to be located just beneath the Pedipalps. I've not seen this previously and he didn't stay around long enough for me to get a good look, but does that sound familiar or indicate sexual maturity?

Thank you.

 

[cold blood]

Yeah, its mature.

How long ago did the metallica molt?

 

[Cutler]

Yeah, its mature.

How long ago did the metallica molt?

Thanks for clarifying the Singapore Blue situation. Is there only a limited period in which he can mate following this final moult, or do males continues to create sperm webs up until they pass?

The Metallica moulted around the same time as the Singapore Blue which was about 3 months ago, perhaps a little longer. She hasn't eaten since.

 

[cold blood]

Thanks for clarifying the Singapore Blue situation. Is there only a limited period in which he can mate following this final moult, or do males continues to create sperm webs up until they pass?

The Metallica moulted around the same time as the Singapore Blue which was about 3 months ago, perhaps a little longer. She hasn't eaten since.

There will certainly come a point where he will stop making sperm webs. Fresher males are generally better breeding options, as knowing exactly when his potency drops is just not possible as far as I know.

That's a long time for a t to not eat post-molt. I have a few questions....first, have you been able to see its fangs, to make sure they are both intact. I've had t's lose fangs and while they would briefly go after prey, they would give up quickly as making the kill isn't as easy without pointy objects to jab into the prey. The next question is, how many different kinds of prey items have you tried? At times they can be quite picky and really prefer one item over another. Wax worms work for picky eaters IME. Have you tried offering pre-killed prey?

3 months without food following a molt is actually quite worrisome in my eyes and definitely something to keep watch on. I assume it has access to water?

 

[Cutler]

There will certainly come a point where he will stop making sperm webs. Fresher males are generally better breeding options, as knowing exactly when his potency drops is just not possible as far as I know.

That's a long time for a t to not eat post-molt. I have a few questions....first, have you been able to see its fangs, to make sure they are both intact. I've had t's lose fangs and while they would briefly go after prey, they would give up quickly as making the kill isn't as easy without pointy objects to jab into the prey. The next question is, how many different kinds of prey items have you tried? At times they can be quite picky and really prefer one item over another. Wax worms work for picky eaters IME. Have you tried offering pre-killed prey?

3 months without food following a molt is actually quite worrisome in my eyes and definitely something to keep watch on. I assume it has access to water?

Hi,

Thank you for some very interesting considerations. To address your first question: I can't be certain about the condition of her fangs but I will endeavour to investigate the possibility when the opportunity presents itself. I have tried a couple of times this afternoon, but she keeps bolting for her hide when I twist the enclosure.

I am a firm believer in varying food sources and have tried Wax Worms, along with Meal Worms, Roaches and Small Locusts - but nothing seems to be working.

Once I have confirmed the fang situation, and in the event that everything is ok, I may try moving her into a different enclosure. I purchased two aquariums earlier and may convert one of them into a Arboreal set-up.

I check water everyday, so her dish is always topped up.

I really appreciate all the help. Thank you.

 

[cold blood]

Crickets are a mainstay, have you tried those?

I will say that aquariums make less than ideal enclosures, especially for arboreals. Many, if not most long time keepers tend to not use them very much, if at all. Unless you are a skilled glass blower, making proper cross ventilation in a glass aquarium is basically impossible, leaving you with the less than ideal option of a dammed screen top on a tipped aquarium. I would strongly suggest going to plastic or acrylic as they can be drilled out in any way needed and ventilation.

As for checking the fangs, you are pretty much going to need her on the glass. I keep reading glasses in my t room as well to help me see the little things like this, or when attempting to sex a t....your eyesight may not require that, but I will say it helps me and reading glasses are very very cheap.

 

[Cutler]

Crickets are a mainstay, have you tried those?

I will say that aquariums make less than ideal enclosures, especially for arboreals. Many, if not most long time keepers tend to not use them very much, if at all. Unless you are a skilled glass blower, making proper cross ventilation in a glass aquarium is basically impossible, leaving you with the less than ideal option of a dammed screen top on a tipped aquarium. I would strongly suggest going to plastic or acrylic as they can be drilled out in any way needed and ventilation.

As for checking the fangs, you are pretty much going to need her on the glass. I keep reading glasses in my t room as well to help me see the little things like this, or when attempting to sex a t....your eyesight may not require that, but I will say it helps me and reading glasses are very very cheap.

During the initial stages of keeping Tarantulas I used Crickets almost exclusively. However, mite infestations became intolerable and would often migrate to surrounding enclosures and contaminate everything. As I became more familiar with the mechanics of this hobby, I bought some Roaches and started a colony. For the most part these are eagerly consumed, but a couple of my T's flatly refuse to accommodate this prey, so also breed meal worms too - this seems to cover the palate spectrum of my Tarantulas. But tomorrow I will buy some crickets and see if they can stimulate any interest. I'll just move the enclosure away from the rest of my collection to minimise contamination in the event the dreaded mites return. I've tried absolutely everything to eliminate this problem, but have been terribly unsuccessful. With tedious consistency, about a week after feeding my T's Crickets, mites would appear in the enclosures, regardless of ventilation and moisture levels. But I will revisit this form of prey next week, as I'm very concerned about my Metallica.

Thank you for the advice concerning glass tanks and I will of course now look for alternatives in plastic. In fact, most of my collection is housed in plastic with the exception of the Salmon Pink, and that was simply due to accommodating the rapid size increases and having no other option at the time she needed to be rehoused. But she has never given me one days problem; always a fantastic feeder and healthy moulter, regardless.

Once the Metallica reappears and provides an opportunity to view her properly, I'll have my magnifying glass at the ready. Thank you for all the ideas.

 

[cold blood]

@Cutler,
re:crickets

I would suggest getting a few. But yes, crickets, especially most of the popular species sold in the pet trade, can become susceptible to mites, and I agree it can be annoying to see even one, cause they are not usually alone. I'm going to give you a specific cricket to look for, that's banded, or tropical house crickets that are now being bred in most places as a direct result of a disease that nearly destroyed many cricket retailers some time ago. This species is much more pest/disease resistant, don't smell like other species of feeders, are easier to keep, and since my LPS made the change I had nearly forgotten the mite issues with the common domestic grey crickets I had previously fed...till I got a few dozen of another species last winter...oops, suddenly I had to dry everyone out because I saw a bunch of mites in the cricket enclosure.http://www.livefoodsdirect.co.uk/Category/Banded-Crickets

Banded crickets are a little smaller, but still plenty big enough for large ts, and are more "athletic". They have bigger back legs and (get this) are climbers and can jump about 5 times better than other species(my estimation). As a result, they do less hiding under things and often climb wood and walk right to arboreal ts, where their enhanced speed is of no use. They are also more active movers, if they freeze, I can shine a light in their eyes and they move quickly away.

Also you could just buy crickets for this one t and only buy 1-3 at a time, this will reduce your issues if this t is the only one preferring them (if that turns out to be the case).

There's actually lots of good reasons to use banded crickets.

https://www.joshsfrogs.com/catalog/...you-should-feed-banded-crickets-to-your-pets/

 

[Cutler]

@Cutler,
re:crickets

I would suggest getting a few. But yes, crickets, especially most of the popular species sold in the pet trade, can become susceptible to mites, and I agree it can be annoying to see even one, cause they are not usually alone. I'm going to give you a specific cricket to look for, that's banded, or tropical house crickets that are now being bred in most places as a direct result of a disease that nearly destroyed many cricket retailers some time ago. This species is much more pest/disease resistant, don't smell like other species of feeders, are easier to keep, and since my LPS made the change I had nearly forgotten the mite issues with the common domestic grey crickets I had previously fed...till I got a few dozen of another species last winter...oops, suddenly I had to dry everyone out because I saw a bunch of mites in the cricket enclosure.http://www.livefoodsdirect.co.uk/Category/Banded-Crickets

Banded crickets are a little smaller, but still plenty big enough for large ts, and are more "athletic". They have bigger back legs and (get this) are climbers and can jump about 5 times better than other species(my estimation). As a result, they do less hiding under things and often climb wood and walk right to arboreal ts, where their enhanced speed is of no use. They are also more active movers, if they freeze, I can shine a light in their eyes and they move quickly away.

Also you could just buy crickets for this one t and only buy 1-3 at a time, this will reduce your issues if this t is the only one preferring them (if that turns out to be the case).

There's actually lots of good reasons to use banded crickets.

https://www.joshsfrogs.com/catalog/...you-should-feed-banded-crickets-to-your-pets/

Thank you, that's really kind to provide the link and take the time to explain all this. I will definitely pursue this breed of Crickets, but do you think it would be a good idea to purchase a tub of conventional shop feeders tomorrow? I am admittedly anxious about my Metallica and would like to investigate this option as soon as possible. But the information you've provided is very interesting; I will order a few tubs and see how my collection reacts.

Excellent stuff. Thank you.

 

[cold blood]

lol, a tub? I'd go to a pet store and buy one single cricket, just to see if this particular t will take it...after that, I'd make the decision to buy more....unless you are buying banded, then just get them cause the other ts will certainly snap them up, but its not like you have a feeder shortage, just one potentially very picky eater in that P. met.

Glad you found the info useful.

 

[Cutler]

lol, a tub? I'd go to a pet store and but one single cricket, just to see if this particular t will take it...after that, I'd make the decision to buy more....unless you are buying banded, then just get them cause the other ts will certainly snap them up, but its not like you have a feeder shortage, just one potentially very picky eater in that P. met.

Glad you found the info useful.

My local store only sells the tubs; they would call security if I asked for a single Cricket...lol. They are very cheap and I also have a friend that owns a small bearded dragon, so I'm sure the rest will be well received by him.

You've been an incredible help. Thank you for your patience and continued guidance. I'll return with an update once I've experimented with the crickets. Hope you don't mind.

 

[Chris LXXIX]

Try this. Buy Acheta domesticus, not from (common, i mean) "Pet Shops" but from those who are into T's and inverts (better); here in Italy, even if there's an Arachnid Ban still ON since 2003, normal Pet Shops doesn't sell crickets, nor dubia etc actually, they never did, but we have inverts (T's as well) people who breed and sell those online (i assume in England as well theres those).

2. Put the crickets in a full, cross ventilation enclosure. No substrate at all. Give those crickets carrots (both food & humidity/water)

3. Offer the crickets to T's. Remove asap the boluse and you're done. No mites

Not talking chat i've heard but what i've did (and i continue to) for 25 years into T's.

 

[Cutler]

Try this. Buy Acheta domesticus, not from (common, i mean) "Pet Shops" but from those who are into T's and inverts (better); here in Italy, even if there's an Arachnid Ban still ON since 2003, normal Pet Shops doesn't sell crickets, nor dubia etc actually, they never did, but we have inverts (T's as well) people who breed and sell those online (i assume in England as well theres those).

2. Put the crickets in a full, cross ventilation enclosure. No substrate at all. Give those crickets carrots (both food & humidity/water)

3. Offer the crickets to T's. Remove asap the boluse and you're done. No mites

Not talking chat i've heard but what i've did (and i continue to) for 25 years into T's.

Thank you for this information, Chris. I'll be certain to experiment with all the brilliant ideas and advice I've received so far. I'm actually (although tentatively) looking forward to reintroducing Crickets. Never thought I would be saying that; I still snarl at them when I walk past in the pet store ..lol.

You've been a great help. As always, thank you.

 

[gottarantulas]

Recently, a fellow local enthusiast/hobbyist was distressed about his P.smithi not having eaten for 3 weeks straight. When I reviewed his set up, I felt that one of the prime factors plausibly impacting his T's not wanting to eat was that they were not at an ideal temperature (e.g: they were a bit on the cool side). He too was frustrated by an infestation of mites and thus had done away with a source of warmth which he felt was inviting and cultivating the mites. I suggested using jungle mix and over the ensuing two weeks, allow the enclosure to dry out, allowing the humidity to come from the water dish/cup within the enclosure, noting that the humidity would be derived when coupled with a heat source, in this case the enclosure being kept in a heated cabinet (ala' Paul Becker). Two days later he called to note that his T had started taking male dubia.