Iridopelma seladonium & Pterinopelma sazimai

[Storm76]

Does anyone in the US own either of these species? If so, where did you acquire them from and how do you keep them? (Pictures would be awesome!)

I've asked around a lot and I. seladonium is sought after like crazy over here, but alas, even M. Scheller, who owned a breeding pair, couldn't keep them alive. They're believed to have died out in the hobby over here in Europe from what I can tell. I believe I heard that these aren't exported either, so I'm curious if anyone in the US breeds them even? (Here's a pic of those: CLICK)


As for the Pterinopelma sazimai, this one looks quite close to certain Brachy's if you ask me, except for the really blue legs. But since the picture was apparently taken by Caroline S. Fukushima, I don't believe it's just an old species newly described / reclassified.
Here's the article about it: CLICK

So does anyone keep either?

 

[Philth]

If you Germans don't have them, chances are we don't have them here.

Later, Tom

 

[Kazaam]

There is only one I. seladonium left, that one is in Germany and is not for sale...

 

[Storm76]

There is only one I. seladonium left, that one is in Germany and is not for sale...

Who's the owner (don't want a name, just if it's a collector or importer/seller)? Since Michael's died off sadly it's not him I recon?

 

[Kazaam]

Who's the owner (collector or seller)? Since Michael's died off sadly it's not him I recon?

I'm not sure if it was him, if he had 2 of them I don't think so, unless he acquired another one recently (as in like less than a month ago)

 

[Storm76]

I'm not sure if it was him, if he had 2 of them I don't think so, unless he acquired another one recently (as in like less than a month ago)

I talked to H. Manstein just a couple days ago and he mentioned Michael HAD a breeding pair that sadly died off...hm. Guess I'll have to ask Michael himself then.


Alright, so what about the Pterinopelma sazimai? Any info if someone keeps those anywhere in the hobby?

 

[Kazaam]

Alright, so what about the Pterinopelma sazimai? Any info if someone keeps those anywhere in the hobby?

I don't know anything about those, I just randomly found a page about some guy keeping a single iridopelma seladonium in germany.

 

[Storm76]

If you Germans don't have them, chances are we don't have them here.

Later, Tom

Not entirely true, Tom. Certain Aphonopelmas for example are interesting enough kinda more rare for example. Still looking for a moorae...

I don't know anything about those, I just randomly found a page about some guy keeping a single iridopelma seladonium in germany.

Interesting, but I'm guessing it was Michaels you talk about => CLICK

Well, let's see if someone else can contribute some information...thanks!

 

[zonbonzovi]

Good luck getting them in any legal fashion and if not legal...don't forget to clench your butt cheeks up real tight after you're discovered by customs on a departing flight from Rio.:laugh:

 

[Storm76]

Good luck getting them in any legal fashion and if not legal...don't forget to clench your butt cheeks up real tight after you're discovered by customs on a departing flight from Rio.:laugh:

No spider is worth getting into problems with the law, IMO. But I see what you're talking about. The last info I received was that Dr.Sylvia Lucas (former leader of the Instituto Butantan) told someone they had some, but they're also KEEPING them and don't export - sadly

EDIT:
I just stumbled upon a breeder offering the 1. European captive-bred batch of the Pterinopelma sazimai...obviously being available at Marbach! Gonna contact that guy tomorrow and see if I can snatch up a couple... - CLICK -his female

 

[BiGpDaMoNsTa]

I have received news that Pterinopelma sazimai will soon be available in Canada;P.... i'm sure they won't be for very long though

 

[Storm76]

Well, the one thing I'm wondering about now is who smuggled the breeding pairs? Because if I'm not mistaken, Brazil doesn't export its spiders? That seller offering them, also offers O. diamantinensis and P. metallica (the latter for 25-30 EUR per animal) - kinda weird, but we'll see.

EDIT: I decided against buying from that person. Reasons are quite some bad reviews about transactions which made it look kinda fishy. Let's hope they'll get established in the hobby in the future. That would be very nice.

 

[Philth]

Not entirely true, Tom. Certain Aphonopelmas for example are interesting enough kinda more rare for example. Still looking for a moorae...

Not entirely true, but true 99.9% of the time. Of course some Aphonopelma will be easier for us to obtain than you guys over seas, but that is very different when we are talking about getting spiders out of Brazil. I don't believe Germans have a Lacy Act like we have here that prevents us from bringing in smuggled animals from prohibited country's.

Someone once told me a old joke , I forgot how it goes but it was something like...

"A new species is discovered in Brazil on a Monday, on Tuesday two Germans buy plane tickets to Brazil" lol

As well A. moorae was prob a poor example as I've never seen them offered for sale in the US. With the exception of maybe one or two people that got their hands on a couple over the last 10-15 years I wouldn't say they are available to us. I'm unsure if any of them were confirmed to be the real A. moorae anyways.

It wont be long before the U.S. has Pterinopelma sazimai, as you now see they are available by you and soon in Canada. But we will have to wait for you guys to captive breed them over there, so we can legally import them here. Its a silly loop hole, but that's how it works.

Later, Tom

 

[Storm76]

It wont be long before the U.S. has Pterinopelma sazimai, as you now see they are available by you and soon in Canada. But we will have to wait for you guys to captive breed them over there, so we can legally import them here. Its a silly loop hole, but that's how it works.

Later, Tom

You know, the only thing annoying me honestly, is the fact that all this smuggling obviously goes unnoticed, unpunished really. Spider's aren't "popular" and we hobbyists are considered "weird" most of the time in the least, but seriously? I'm just waiting for yet another newspaper story "Spiders discovered in luggage - German tried to smuggle" yaddayadda you know what I mean. It doesn't shine a good light on our hobby over here either, which is why I tend to stick to honest breeders where I know what I get, even if that means that I pay a little more...

 

[Philth]

You know, the only thing annoying me honestly, is the fact that all this smuggling obviously goes unnoticed, unpunished really. Spider's aren't "popular" and we hobbyists are considered "weird" most of the time in the least, but seriously? I'm just waiting for yet another newspaper story "Spiders discovered in luggage - German tried to smuggle" yaddayadda you know what I mean. It doesn't shine a good light on our hobby over here either, which is why I tend to stick to honest breeders where I know what I get, even if that means that I pay a little more...

If you don't want to support smuggling wouldn't a good way to start is by not buying the 2 spiders you mentioned in this thread lol. You prob have a many spiders in your collection that smugglers profited from. I don't want to turn your thread into a smuggling debate, but I see no harm in taking a few to breed for the pet trade. I agree nobody wants to see suitcases full of animals being removed from the environment though. There will always be a demand for colorful new species that will tempt smugglers.

Later, Tom

 

[MaskFac3]

Tbh though it would be ideal if there are enough left that some really proficient breeders could be aloud pairs so they could be captive bred. Then in turn the sling could be sent to other experience people and eventually normal hobbyists could have them - it would take away the need to smuggle them.

 

[Storm76]

If you don't want to support smuggling wouldn't a good way to start is by not buying the 2 spiders you mentioned in this thread lol. You prob have a many spiders in your collection that smugglers profited from. I don't want to turn your thread into a smuggling debate, but I see no harm in taking a few to breed for the pet trade. I agree nobody wants to see suitcases full of animals being removed from the environment though. There will always be a demand for colorful new species that will tempt smugglers.

Later, Tom

Which is EXACTLY why I decided against purchasing them. (Especially from that "breeder" in question after I did some research...) - anways: You're right, Tom. I wanted to see if there is somewhere a CB bred population already established, even if it would be small. But that will take a few years before that happens and I can wait - this hobby teaches it to you quite well actually

 

[advan]

I wanted to see if there is somewhere a CB bred population already established, even if it would be small. But that will take a few years before that happens and I can wait - this hobby teaches it to you quite well actually

Why does it matter if you get them now or in a few generations? They still will be descendants of smuggled material. Unless of course you wait until Brazil opens it's borders. Have fun with that! I wouldn't doubt that a few spiders in your collection now have come from a sketchy background somewhere down the line.

I understand you don't want to support it but it's almost unavoidable if your want some of the rarer species. The breeding stock had to come from somewhere at some point. It would be nice if we had more people like Steve Nunn that legally export CB spiders for the hobby to enjoy.

 

[Storm76]

Why does it matter if you get them now or in a few generations? They still will be descendants of smuggled material. Unless of course you wait until Brazil opens it's borders. Have fun with that! I wouldn't doubt that a few spiders in your collection now have come from a sketchy background somewhere down the line.

I understand you want don't want to support it but it's almost unavoidable if your want some of the rarer species. The breeding stock had to come from somewhere at some point. It would be nice if we had more people like Steve Nunn that legally export CB spiders for the hobby to enjoy.

I know, Chad. But I have my reasons for having decided against getting them from the person that offers them currently. There's quite some evidence on the net regarding that person and I'm certainly NOT supporting such a person. I know it's twisted reality in a way and you're probably right regarding the fact some spiders people keep are likely the descendants from formerly WC spiders - but that's basically true for ALL T's in the hobby at some point.

 

[kongekilde]

just to come with some late input
I have the Pterinopelma sazimai, but of the iridopelma gruppe I have oly found 2 up for sale, I so I have the iridopelma hirsutum whith is the one and same as iridopelma sp. recife. then I found the iridopelma zorodes yesterday and ar whaiting for the mess in hamm so I can go get the ones I reserved
this it hobby breed,but at some point if u buy spider or any other animal from brazil ar it have not ben dreed in the hobby,u will for 100% sure support smuggling. as its against the law to export any animals out of brlzil :-/ and even the ones we have in the hobby have at some point ben smuggling out of the contry but now they ar in the hobby,and im not a shame to be a owner off some of them
i can say,that they come at a werry werry hige price,but they a out ther to buy ;-)