1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.

Iridopelma, Pachistopelma, Typhochlaena Revision

Discussion in 'Tarantula Questions & Discussions' started by advan, Oct 24, 2012.

  1. advan

    advan raptorer Staff Member

    • Like Like x 16
  2. Introvertebrate

    Introvertebrate Arachnobaron

    • Like Like x 4
  3. netr

    netr Arachnoknight

    159
    169
    83
    Finland
    • Like Like x 2
  4. captmarga

    captmarga Arachnobaron

    338
    174
    283
    Texas
    They are lovely, I can only hope that the areas will be controlled and managed so the wild population is not decimated. If a conservationist will control collection, they could still make their way into the hobby in small breeding populations, so that we could enjoy these as captive-bred in future years. Pricey? Sure, but better for the species than wiping it out...

    Marga
     
  5. andrewpzb

    andrewpzb Arachnopeon

    stunning new tarantulas
     
  6. Billeh

    Billeh Arachnosquire

    Nine new species discovered

    Nine new additions to my "must have" list
    http://www.upi.com/Science_News/201...ling-tarantulas-described/UPI-90391351640008/
    http://esciencenews.com/articles/20...ed.tree.dwelling.tarantulas.discovered.brazil

    "In addition all the new species are colorful, the researchers said, which could constitute another threat because it might make them attractive for the pet trade."
    I feel guilty that when I began reading this, I thought "Man I HAVE to get me one of these!!"
     
    Last edited: Oct 31, 2012
  7. Aarantula

    Aarantula Arachnobaron

    311
    11
    0
    NJ
    Lol! Thought the same!
     
  8. Merfolk

    Merfolk Arachnoprince Old Timer

    Captive breeding would help. but Brazil prefers to protect its species, by paving their environnement.
     
    • Like Like x 3
  9. Storm76

    Storm76 Arachnoemperor

    3,660
    3,941
    578
    Germany
    "Furthermore, all these new species are colorful, which could attract the interest for capturing them for the pet trade, constituting another threat."

    Let's hope they'll get preserved.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  10. sjl197

    sjl197 Arachnoknight

    Actually Merfolk, Brasil is one of the best countries in the world for funding biodiversity studies, far ahead of most 'Western' countries for supporting the kind of research that allowed Dr. Bertani to make this very useful study.

    However, Brasil is also a rapidly expanding economy, with a vast multitude of very poor peoples who deserve aid and support.

    I personally would be very happy to see controlled and regulated breeding programs of these in Brasil, and i would have no problem with some exports being put into the hobbytrade, especially if funding from sales went back to support such research and actual conservation initiatives like protecting their native habitat from deforestation or poaching, etc. However, currently Brasilian law is very restrictive, and getting changes made to those laws will not be helped by the smuggling that myself and many others foresee (inc. i suspect Dr Bertani) from the publication of details on the locations and habitats of these beautiful new species.

    So,
    Firstly, Congratulations to Dr. Bertani

    Secondly, a plee to forum members (as several above do) to think about any demands you and others make to see these species in the hobby will most likely fuel illegal smuggling. Such illegal status applies also to any captive born/raised offspring you might buy. Resultantly, your money will go to fund the smugglers and traders in smuggled species to make more illegal collections of others. I suggest your money might be better spent elsewhere, but its your money and your conscience.
     
    • Like Like x 7
  11. Last edited: Nov 1, 2012
  12. Tarac

    Tarac Arachnolord

    617
    409
    0
    Florida
    It's important to note that while the economy expands, the gap between rich and poor only increases here. Poverty also motivates poaching, deforestation for raw materials and farmland, etc. No need to delve into that further, it's a global crisis related to our ever growing population.

    But I'm curious, as someone who has more first hand experience in these matters than most of us, do you know of examples where a tightening of laws ever ultimately benefits the natural environment? The idea is that it will help preserve the natural area, but what we typically see is closing of borders and then internal destruction of what resources are left. Since the human population always grows it seems it eventually will inevitably be the environment pitted against the needs of the underprivileged, ever growing human community, a battle in which the environment loses every time. Very few countries recognize the environment as having any legal status at all- Bolivia is an interesting beacon on that front- so it is afforded very little protection when tested.

    Of course I am not asking because I support smuggling at all, I agree with you for all the reasons you mentioned. But I do think about what happens to all of these wonderful plants and animals that are threatened by the scramble for resources. More of an ethical question, i.e. when or if it is ever justified for some currently non-existent international body to intervene on the behalf of the environment when the host country is demonstrating neglect.

    I'm not sure I would consider Brazil as being better or worse at funding than 'western' countries or what that has to do with the protection of species ultimately anyway since the knowledge doesn't necessarily mean it will ever amount to conservation. Do you have figures to support that? The UN, for example, just pledged to increase annual support by double just this past October to developing countries needing assistance in funding their internal biodiversity studies. This is just one amongst many other initiatives provided by 'first world' countries for developing nations research- in other words, much of the funding in Brazil for biodiversity studies is coming from 'western' countries, including the many international carbon grants, funds from places like the US and Germany for allowing offshore oil drilling and steel adn engineering plants, and so on. Not exactly environmentally conscience. More a balance act to appear good on paper whilst continuing to favor business development of natural lands all the while. While true, they do have obligate fees for development by industry, they amount to something legally almost identical to US so-called "mitigation" fees which are basically useless. So to pat Brazil on the back I think is a little hasty. This is not at all to diminish Dr. Bertani's work- very seldom are the efforts of researchers in line with those of the national bodies governing what happens to the focus of their study.

    This is where the ethical question comes in- if we know a country is not going to protect it's own land, when should it be a global right to intervene? There has been some initiative taken in the form of the aforementioned grants. However, as usual it has to filter through the government and various administrators, eventually getting subverted along the way until a few pennies on the dollar make their way into actual research while the rest pads pockets and is spent in the legal arena finding ways to subvert and circumnavigate the original intention of the funds.

    What qualifies Brazil as a leader then given that much of their funds are derived the same way ours are if they are not directly contributed by 'western' countries, besides of course that it naturally has more to protect than places like Europe or North America where biodiversity has been relatively very low since the last ice age? It's an honest question, not an attack.

    I love about these boards that hobbyists like myself can ask the few experts in the field important questions.
     
    Last edited: Nov 2, 2012
  13. poisoned

    poisoned Arachnodemon

    In Slovenia it's illegal to clear the forest. Only individual trees can be cut down. Of course it makes forest management a little more expensive, but it makes it very sustainable. Forestation has grown from 40% to 60% in past 100 years due to this regulation and is still growing, making Slovenia third most forested country in Europe.
     
  14. macbaffo

    macbaffo Arachnolord

    650
    200
    83
    Italy
    R: Iridopelma, Pachistopelma, Typhochlaena Revision

    I would add also that the population of wild animals is strictly controlled. Hunters have to kill every year a certain numbers of individuals (usually sick or old ones)of every species in order to maintain stable or almost stable the population of that species. Hunters are organized in groups called families that have to control and look after a portion of territory. If a family doesn't reach the agreed amount of kills or exceeds the number than they have pay a fine.
     
  15. kongekilde

    kongekilde Arachnosquire

    I dont know if we ar in luck or what, but her in europa we allready have some of the new sp. and they ar breed with in the hobby,and ar now starting to pop uo for sale,but at a werry hige price :-/ I have my self just borght 5 iridopelma zorodes and ar whating for it to be summer so i can get my shipment of pachistopelma rufoningrum :) but when i see the prices in usa an canada im thinking,maby its not bad at all,as I belive the prises ther is to damn hige:eek: so even a hige price her in eu is still nothing,when i see the prices in the us
     
  16. poisoned

    poisoned Arachnodemon

    Remember, when new species are discovered there are always two germans buying airplane tickezs and packing vials.

    We really are lucky with prices and availability here. The rest of the world is only dreaming about 35$ P. metallica slings.
     
  17. kongekilde

    kongekilde Arachnosquire

    yes the price for P.metallica at 35,- is a werry good price, but her the price for them go a bit down ever year,last summer it was about 45,- now its about 35,- here to, I my self ar whating to get cocons on them,and my price will be 200 danish kroner, its about the same as 35 dollers, but yes u have a noteher availability,and some i realy like to get my hands on ;-)