Brown recluse problems

[clam1991]

i do the same thing when i find wolfies in my house
right to my emp

he loves picking off the legs before he digs in!!!!

 

[Tarangela]

Nice pic Brian S!!! :clap:

Thing is though....I love all my spiders and outside wolfies...I don't think I could bare to feed them to my scorps...I am sure the scorps would love them, but I just can't do it!

I am waiting to see how this thread ends....I have seen 1 recluse in my life, and it was at Camp Lejuene while in the USMC. This girl was crawling out from one dark corner of the beds one morning....I put her in a cup, and released her in the woods before any more craziness could be caused....if that was bad...well, spank me!

 

[ErgoProxy]

Not quite the threat one might think...

http://spiders.ucr.edu/myth.html


http://spiders.ucr.edu/necrotic.html

 

[Tokendog]

http://spiders.ucr.edu/myth.html


http://spiders.ucr.edu/necrotic.html

Yeah, Brown Recluses are not as bad as every one makes them out to be, but you still wouldn't want to chance it...cause if you get one of the bad ones, that's all it takes to have some problems.

A lot of the bites you see on the internet are bites that were ignored for days before the person realized he should probably get medical treatment.

I'd say, from what I have researched, that a Brown Recluse bite is not some thing that happens and you go, "OMG, OMG, OMG I am going to die or lose a finger." - but rather some thing you go, "I am going to the doctor this afternoon to get it checked out and treated." and if you do the last option, you tend to see no major problems at all other than irritation, swelling, and maybe a scar.

 

[ErgoProxy]

Yeah, Brown Recluses are not as bad as every one makes them out to be, but you still wouldn't want to chance it...cause if you get one of the bad ones, that's all it takes to have some problems.

A lot of the bites you see on the internet are bites that were ignored for days before the person realized he should probably get medical treatment.

I'd say, from what I have researched, that a Brown Recluse bite is not some thing that happens and you go, "OMG, OMG, OMG I am going to die or lose a finger." - but rather some thing you go, "I am going to the doctor this afternoon to get it checked out and treated." and if you do the last option, you tend to see no major problems at all other than irritation, swelling, and maybe a scar.

Agreed.

I lived in Brown Recluse country for 3 years and even had them beneath my graduate office/lab desk at times.

The big danger usually came from putting on clothing/shoes with one hiding in it...and a bite could occur. But if you saw it, then you could go in for some minor treatments that would in most cases take care of any issues from the bite (saw it with a lab student I had one year and his fiance, who was bitten...treatment and NO reaction).

Everyone though potentially can react differently and many of the Sicaridae do appear to have a necrotic venom.

 

[Tokendog]

Agreed.

I lived in Brown Recluse country for 3 years and even had them beneath my graduate office/lab desk at times.

The big danger usually came from putting on clothing/shoes with one hiding in it...and a bite could occur. But if you saw it, then you could go in for some minor treatments that would in most cases take care of any issues from the bite (saw it with a lab student I had one year and his fiance, who was bitten...treatment and NO reaction).

Everyone though potentially can react differently and many of the Sicaridae do appear to have a necrotic venom.

Another problem, as I think you were suggesting, is that most reports state the Brown Recluse feels like a pin prick and can go unnoticed or ignored unintentionally, as the victim does not recognize the danger of what really happened, and often bites happen when people are sleeping and the Brown Recluse gets in to the sheets. The person thinks he has a mosquito bite or just small irritating wound, not realizing what it is, and goes a bit longer before realizing its a bigger issue. By then the necrosis has started to set in and the venom has been allowed to get in to the blood stream thoroughly.

Also, in the South, we have the Creoles from down da bayou who think they are tougher than nails and that nothing like that is some thing to worry about. I know more than a few of those. =P

P.S. Thanks btw, Brian, as your pic of the Scorp with the Brown Recluse has allowed me to convince my wife that my next hobby should be collecting Scorpions. :>

 

[Hamburglar]

Forgot about this thread.... I found the name of the doctor who said that as little as 20% of recluse bite victims show a reaction. You can read about him here. He has been on tv a few times. Smarter than me anyway...

http://lomalindahealth.org/medical-center/our-services/emergency/programs-and-divisions/venom-er/our-doctors/index.html

 

[ErgoProxy]

Forgot about this thread.... I found the name of the doctor who said that as little as 20% of recluse bite victims show a reaction. You can read about him here. He has been on tv a few times. Smarter than me anyway...

http://lomalindahealth.org/medical-center/our-services/emergency/programs-and-divisions/venom-er/our-doctors/index.html

Yeah, that is what the information on Univ of Ca-Riverside site was saying. The majority of the bites don't cause a severe reaction, and that there are other possible causes of necrosis, but the recluses get blamed, time and time again, even in areas where they are not known to be native and accidental importations are rare.

Media driven hysteria, and often times over-zealous ER room staff.

That is not to say there are not cases of spider induced necrosis and that possibly some Sicaridae (thinking that South African desert dwelling Sicarius) could be potentially necrotic with a non-dry bite. Just that things are really overblown for the brown recluse.

 

[The Snark]

Once upon a time long long ago a professor at the dept of Ent., UCR requested that people bring in what they suspected as Loxo Rec. Students and faculty brought dozens of pideys in over the months. The professor was having a grand old time as he got a very good cross section of nearly every common spider found in So. Cal. Orb weavers, latro's, salticids and even the occasional taran. There were no Loxo Rec. in the wash of course, until a student of his snuck one in he had imported from the mid west.

The purpose behind the professors spider bounty was twofold. First to prove there were no loxo in the area and second, to impress upon his students the proper methods for capture, (time, date and location-habitat), and the necessity of properly identifying the spider and not jumping to conclusions. (Like I do!)

 

[buthus]

...The purpose behind the professors spider bounty was twofold. First to prove there were no loxo in the area...

Well, I gotta tel ya, my SoCal loxos were all shocked to hear this.

 

[The Snark]

Well, I gotta tel ya, my SoCal loxos were all shocked to hear this.

Long time ago It appears that Loxos are becoming much more cosmopolitan over the years. Anyone remember the big panic when they were found in Sierra Madre in So. Cal.?
That's a cutey. Where is it from?

 

[What]

Long time ago It appears that Loxos are becoming much more cosmopolitan over the years. Anyone remember the big panic when they were found in Sierra Madre in So. Cal.?
That's a cutey. Where is it from?

There are native species of Loxosceles in southern California. Though, they are usually found out in obscure canyons and such.

Also, I havent heard of any panic associated with the L. laeta in Sierra Madre, the entire population is contained in the basement of a commercial building there.

 

[clam1991]

so.. hardlucktatto has pitbull lady gotten the recluse you sent her?
have we gotten a positive id?

 

[ErgoProxy]

There are native species of Loxosceles in southern California. Though, they are usually found out in obscure canyons and such.

Also, I havent heard of any panic associated with the L. laeta in Sierra Madre, the entire population is contained in the basement of a commercial building there.

That's Loxosceles deserta I believe you are referring to...

http://spiders.ucr.edu/images/colorloxmap.gif

Rick even mentioned that introductions of Loxosceles reclusa, though rare are possible (esp. if items/people come from known L. reclusa territory in the Midwest).

We've had similar situation in WI....and we are closer to the natural range of L. reclusa, but no native populations here.

 

[What]

Yes, it is L. deserta, because we know that we have found and correctly identified all the Loxosceles in the Southwestern US....

 

[ErgoProxy]

Yes, it is L. deserta, because we know that we have found and correctly identified all the Loxosceles in the Southwestern US....

Well for now at least...

 

[buthus]

Tokendog, is there any difference in size when comparing the ones u find indoors vs the ones found in tree bark?

That's a cutey. Where is it from?

This one is from around the Salton Sea, but ive found loxos much closer to LA.
Yes, we do assume these are L.deserta, though I probably have kept L.palma and L.arizonica with the deserta label on the cup. US loxos are mostly fairly tough to ID. Ive been collecting some really dwarfish ones at a spot in Vegas..thought they were immature, but some produced offspring.

 

[ErgoProxy]

Tokendog, is there any difference in size when comparing the ones u find indoors vs the ones found in tree bark?






This one is from around the Salton Sea, but ive found loxos much closer to LA.
Yes, we do assume these are L.deserta, though I probably have kept L.palma and L.arizonica with the deserta label on the cup. US loxos are mostly fairly tough to ID. Ive been collecting some really dwarfish ones at a spot in Vegas..thought they were immature, but some produced offspring.

Haven't looked at the genetalia of any Loxosceles in some time so I cannot recall the complexity, but as in some groups it may be easier to id from the males than the females....think it was down to clearing the epigynum and spermethecal structure for the females, but I could be wrong (as it has been some time).

 

[ErgoProxy]

I can't recall offhand if there is a more current revision of the genus than this one...


Gertsch WJ, Ennik F. 1983. The spider genus Loxosceles in North America, Central America, and the West Indies (Araneae, Loxoscelidae). Bulletin, American Museum of Natural History 175: 265-360.


(have the reference at home, unfortunately).

 

[herpguy]

My neighbor used to work with a guy who lost his leg to a recluse bite. My personal advice is to just not reach into any crevices around your home.
-Dave