acteon or iheringi

[barabootom]

What are the main differences between Grammostola acteon and Grammostola iheringi? I've seen pictures of acteon posted here that very much resemble my iheringi.

http://www.arachnoboards.com/ab/showthread.php?t=20106&page=33

Here are pics of my iheringi females. This first one is a 4 in female that I'm sure is iheringi.

And here is my 6 in female that looks like iheringi in the photo but doesn't have quite the hairiness of my younger female iheringi or as red an abdomen when in person. Both have recently molted. Is it just the age difference or is the older female actually acteon? I've also seen pictures of acteon with almost no red. Thanks for your input.

 

[pato_chacoana]

Hello there!

Well, the 'easy' things to differentiate them:
Grammostola actaeon (note spelling) is bulkier and supposed to get a bit larger. The abdomen is not a strong red as it happens with Grammostola iheringi, but it is much darker. The hairs are also different, G. actaeon has shorter thick hair, ''pulchra style''. Both sp. are very large and maybe the biggest Grammostolas in average and fast growing. G. iheringi's synonym by Mello-Leitao was G. gigantea, I guess there was a reason for the name hehe...

Cheers,
Pato

 

[dianedfisher]

What are the main differences between Grammostola acteon and Grammostola iheringi? I've seen pictures of acteon posted here that very much resemble my iheringi.

http://www.arachnoboards.com/ab/showthread.php?t=20106&page=33

Here are pics of my iheringi females. This first one is a 4 in female that I'm sure is iheringi.

And here is my 6 in female that looks like iheringi in the photo but doesn't have quite the hairiness of my younger female iheringi or as red an abdomen when in person. Both have recently molted. Is it just the age difference or is the older female actually acteon? I've also seen pictures of acteon with almost no red. Thanks for your input.

I don't mean to be confrontational, but what makes you think you have a real G.iheringi? I supposedly won one last year, but after doing research I realized that there was very little probablility it was actually an iheringi and much more possible it was an acteon. Di

 

[james]

we should see soon

Diane, one of the spiders Tom has is from me and I was part of a group I bought and it was labeled G iheringi. With that said one of my German friends has some adults of both species I'm going to try and import in a few weeks so I should be able to provide side by side pics of them.
James

 

[Skuikki]

Well, I think you should see it when that second sp. grows to its full size. I had an 15cm / 6'' female sold as actaeon. Here it is:

http://skuikki.1g.fi/kuvat/Grammostolat/gactaeon.JPG
http://skuikki.1g.fi/kuvat/Grammostolat/actaeoni.JPG

This specimen should grow more and it just might lose more of the redness then. I have a iheringi male, it just molted to 15cm / 6'' and didn't mature yet, so I guess females grow quite big ^^

 

[Paramite]

I don't mean to be confrontational, but what makes you think you have a real G.iheringi? I supposedly won one last year, but after doing research I realized that there was very little probablility it was actually an iheringi and much more possible it was an acteon. Di

It doesn't matter whether the hobby iheringi is the real thing or not. The fact that G. iheringi has a LOT longer legs than actaeon, is convincing enough that it's a completely different species, even if it isn't the "real iheringi". I don't know how it's in the states, but here in europe both of them are really easy to find and the differences are easy to spot without much experience.

 

[barabootom]

I don't mean to be confrontational, but what makes you think you have a real G.iheringi? I supposedly won one last year, but after doing research I realized that there was very little probablility it was actually an iheringi and much more possible it was an acteon. Di

Well, I guess that's a valid point. I'm basing it on three things. Pictures I've seen of what people are calling iheringi, what reputable dealers are calling iheringi and on descriptions I've read. Do I have genetic proof I have iheringi?...no. But then how do I know my vagans isn't really vagans X sabulosum cross? Maybe I have iheringi X acteon? I think I have iheringi. Looking at the pics...Do you think they are the same species? Do you think they are iheringi or acteon? I'd appreciate more input. Thanks.

 

[barabootom]

Diane, one of the spiders Tom has is from me and I was part of a group I bought and it was labeled G iheringi. With that said one of my German friends has some adults of both species I'm going to try and import in a few weeks so I should be able to provide side by side pics of them.
James

I think side by side photos would help me out lots. I'll look forward to them. Thanks.

 

[barabootom]

Well, I think you should see it when that second sp. grows to its full size. I had an 15cm / 6'' female sold as actaeon. Here it is:

http://skuikki.1g.fi/kuvat/Grammostolat/gactaeon.JPG
http://skuikki.1g.fi/kuvat/Grammostolat/actaeoni.JPG

This specimen should grow more and it just might lose more of the redness then. I have a iheringi male, it just molted to 15cm / 6'' and didn't mature yet, so I guess females grow quite big ^^

Man, that looks the same. Except that my 6 in female retains a little more red than yours. That's what I mean, how can I be certain what I have before it's 10 years old? What do you think the species is in the photos I posted? Thanks.

 

[barabootom]

I don't know how it's in the states, but here in europe both of them are really easy to find and the differences are easy to spot without much experience.

They are not common in the States and I have never seen them side by side, only in pics. Do you think the two photos I posted are the same species? Iheringi or acteon? I know the photos make it difficult but they are actually a little different in person. The 4 in (top photo) is darker and redder while the 6 inch female (bottom photo) has slightly shorter hair, not quite as red, and not quite as black. Maybe that is just a natural variance but I posted because they are just different enough to cause me confusion. The 4 in female does appear to have longer legs but that might only be becuase she is younger.

 

[Paramite]

They are not common in the States and I have never seen them side by side, only in pics. Do you think the two photos I posted are the same species? Iheringi or acteon? I know the photos make it difficult but they are actually a little different in person. The 4 in (top photo) is darker and redder while the 6 inch female (bottom photo) has slightly shorter hair, not quite as red, and not quite as black. Maybe that is just a natural variance but I posted because they are just different enough to cause me confusion. The 4 in female does appear to have longer legs but that might only be becuase she is younger.

To be honest, I'm going to leave this one to Skuikki. He's more of a Grammostola expert than me, so I'm not even going to start to compare the pictures, because like you said, it can be really hard. The way I remember it, G. iheringi had so long legs for a Grammostola that it really caught my attention, even though I haven't kept many of them.

But let's wait what Skuikki has to say.

Edit: But if I had to choose between them, I'd say the first one is iheringi.

 

[Skuikki]

Man, that looks the same. Except that my 6 in female retains a little more red than yours. That's what I mean, how can I be certain what I have before it's 10 years old? What do you think the species is in the photos I posted? Thanks.

Well, iheringi and actaeon are just those species that you really can't tell the difference so easily.

Your first picture of that specimen seems to lack the red color hiding in the carapace that your second has.
First specimen seems to have blonder curling line on patella, the second has two straighter lines. This means that:

Your first specimen seems to be the same as I've bought as G. iheringi
Your second specimen seems to be the same as I've bought as G. actaeon

I've had 0.0.1 4-6cm G. actaeon, 0.1.0 G. actaeon 15cm and a 1.0.0 G. iheringi 7-15cm all leg spans. At first it was difficult to tell them apart but later on the differences became pretty obvious.

The size difference of your specimens can fool you a little bit. The measuring type and position varies among hobbyist. Did you use LS from leg I to leg IV on one side to the other or one side to the same.

I've HEARD that G. actaeon females will lose the most of the red color of their abdomen when they become full grown adults. As I've had (only) a 15cm LS female I can't say for sure.

It might be a hybrid.. Or you just can't see the difference of these two species. All I can say for sure that their carapace coloration and patella markings are different.

PS: There is a pictures of my iheringi and most other Grammostolas in http://skuikki.1g.fi/kuvat/grammostolat/

 

[Skuikki]

The 4 in (top photo) is darker and redder while the 6 inch female (bottom photo) has slightly shorter hair, not quite as red, and not quite as black. Maybe that is just a natural variance but I posted because they are just different enough to cause me confusion. The 4 in female does appear to have longer legs but that might only be becuase she is younger.

All these little variables suggest that your 4'' is an iheringi and the 6'' is actaeon. And these are the names that are common in pet trade, as I've no experience other than pet trade..

 

[Skuikki]

To be honest, I'm going to leave this one to Skuikki. He's more of a Grammostola expert than me, so I'm not even going to start to compare the pictures, because like you said, it can be really hard. The way I remember it, G. iheringi had so long legs for a Grammostola that it really caught my attention, even though I haven't kept many of them.

But let's wait what Skuikki has to say.

Edit: But if I had to choose between them, I'd say the first one is iheringi.

OT POST: Thanks, You're the first to give me credit for keeping so many Grammostola's. But I'm ashamed to not have any natural or scientific action with this (my favourite) genus.. :/

 

[barabootom]

Your first picture of that specimen seems to lack the red color hiding in the carapace that your second has.
First specimen seems to have blonder curling line on patella, the second has two straighter lines. This means that:

Your first specimen seems to be the same as I've bought as G. iheringi
Your second specimen seems to be the same as I've bought as G. actaeon

Those are very astute observations. Thanks. I use LS from leg I to leg IV on one side to the other. I have read both actaeon and iheringi get quite large, but my larger female should be sexually mature, or a molt or two away. Do all acteon females lose the red coloration? and at what age / size does that happen? As I undertsand it, as both specimens grow the red on the "possible" actaeon should continue to decrease making the difference obvious. That tells me I shouldn't attempt any breeding until I know for sure what the larger female is. That also tells me my female probably isn't sexually mature yet and she will eventually get huge. Thanks for your help.

 

[Skuikki]

Those are very astute observations. Thanks. I use LS from leg I to leg IV on one side to the other. I have read both actaeon and iheringi get quite large, but my larger female should be sexually mature, or a molt or two away. Do all acteon females lose the red coloration? and at what age / size does that happen? As I undertsand it, as both specimens grow the red on the "possible" actaeon should continue to decrease making the difference obvious. That tells me I shouldn't attempt any breeding until I know for sure what the larger female is. That also tells me my female probably isn't sexually mature yet and she will eventually get huge. Thanks for your help.

All I can say for sure is that my G. actaeon was around 15cm LS / 6'' and she had quite a red bum. But she did have much darker red than my iheringi male. It could be that they lose their color in the last few molts when they reach full adult size. Well, you'll have to wait and see what happens

 

[dianedfisher]

Diane, one of the spiders Tom has is from me and I was part of a group I bought and it was labeled G iheringi. With that said one of my German friends has some adults of both species I'm going to try and import in a few weeks so I should be able to provide side by side pics of them.
James

Interesting thread. I sent mine to Anastasia in June so I can't provide any recent pictures. He is male, but not yet mature. Since I didn't have a female and Ana has several G.acteon, I passed him along to her. I guess we'll have to watch him for size comparison when he matures and perhaps try to get some palpal emboli shots if possible. I'll look forward to comparison shots when your new arrivals land. Di